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Update on Right to Carry appeals case, Almeida Vs. Sussex Co.

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Almeida had his hearing today and was denied. The judge said:

 

Find another job, or hire a security firm, and gun in the hand of a good guy will only escalate the situation and make you more of a target.

 

Probably expected but it shows that even with threats justifiable need is a myth. 

 

 

That's this Judge's answer? Are you freaking kidding me? Our country is so out of control it's unbelievable. The arrogance and blatant disregard of the right for an innocent person to protect themselves from evil is not only treasonous, but disingenuous.. 

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That's this Judge's answer? Are you freaking kidding me? Our country is so out of control it's unbelievable. The arrogance and blatant disregard of the right for an innocent person to protect themselves from evil is not only treasonous, but disingenuous.. 

 

That is the judge and the prosecutor's answer. It's in the reply brief from the county prosecutor.

 

It's judge Conforti who apparently is a well known anti and has had some shady stuff surrounding him. 

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That's this Judge's answer? Are you freaking kidding me? Our country is so out of control it's unbelievable. The arrogance and blatant disregard of the right for an innocent person to protect themselves from evil is not only treasonous, but disingenuous.. 

not our country, this state, there are plenty of states that still respect our individual rights 

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Almeida had his hearing today and was denied. The judge said:

 

Find another job, or hire a security firm, and gun in the hand of a good guy will only escalate the situation and make you more of a target.

 

Probably expected but it shows that even with threats justifiable need is a myth. 

 

So what about police, security firm and other "good" guys who carry ? Are they different good guys than this good guy ?

 

Anyone know if OP is appealing ?

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Yes, he will waste tons of money appealing and losing all the way up to SCOTUS, where it will be declined to be heard. The same scenario keeps playing out around here for some reason.

 Sure seems that way. NJ citizens who decide to take a stand and fight back, spend lots of money and time doing so and you get bewildering remarks like this from judge/judges/AGs... or get ignored despite what seems like a slam dunk (and spending much more$) trying to take it further up to the SCOTUS.  We cant fight or buy our way out of this 2A cesspool. So yea, moving looks pretty good.

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Online it says this a-hole judge reached the mandatory retirement age in 2013. I guess anyone in this country can bend and break the rules except citizens...

 

Firearms stuff (issuing ccw's, appeals, etc) is low-priority. As such, if there's a recall judge on staff (like Conforti), that's usually who gets it.

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Actually what we need to do is to organize a coordinated attack upon our suffer-age.  1-20 participants in each of the 21 Counties of NJ, with a similar "Justifiable Need" as Albert's, all need to apply and be denied.  200 attempts and ZERO issued "May Issue" CCW's would then file a Class action suit against the State and use their collective denials as proof that CCW in NJ doesn't exist for the commoner.  Now what we need to do is to identify those willing to stop collecting guns, since once yer denied, you have to say so on all firearms apps after that event.  So whatcha really need is a coupla hundred folks like me who have everything they want already, and don't suffer from "The gun of the month Club".  A coupla hundred Patriots who aren't Pussies.  So who wants to be the next to DECLARE?  And I better not see the thread die or hear nuthin' but Crickets, lol!

 

Dave

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The denial does not effect you ability to purchase additional handguns it just may effect you initial and renewal non-resident ccw permits in other states. I doubt it would prevent you from being approved but just raise a flag that has to be explained. Maine state police questioned me about a minor police contact at my home when I applied the the Maine non resident ccw permitted. I'm sure they would have called to ask about a denial. It was not a problem... I just had to explain what had happened.

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Answering NO to the question about being turned down on a p2p app should not be cause for a "rejection" I asked this question at a Nappen seminar and a cop who was present and is the detective in charge of permits in his department said it is not cause for a rejected application. They basically expect nothing less.

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Actually what we need to do is to organize a coordinated attack upon our suffer-age. 1-20 participants in each of the 21 Counties of NJ, with a similar "Justifi able Need" as Albert's, all need to apply and be denied. 200 attempts and ZERO issued "May Issue" CCW's would then file a Class action suit against the State and use their collective denials as proof that CCW in NJ doesn't exist for the commoner. Now what we need to do is to identify those willing to stop collecting guns, since once yer denied, you have to say so on all firearms apps after that event. So whatcha really need is a coupla hundred folks like me who have everything they want already, and don't suffer from "The gun of the month Club". A coupla hundred Patriots who aren't Pussies. So who wants to be the next to DECLARE? And I better not see the thread die or hear nuthin' but Crickets, lol!

 

Dave

Do you think there is a way someone can organize an event or class where we all go fill out everything have a notary there. Do qualifications prints ect. Make it easy for people to apply. A one stop shop. Something similar to what ranges do for florida ccw permits. Just an idea.

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Do you think there is a way someone can organize an event or class where we all go fill out everything have a notary there. Do qualifications prints ect. Make it easy for people to apply. A one stop shop. Something similar to what ranges do for florida ccw permits. Just an idea.

Brilliant!

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^^I'm not sure.  Let's see who is willing to go the distance....  Why don't YOU do the organizing?  I'm already a Certified Instructor, CRSO, Mentor, Hunter, Discipline Chair, Competitive Shooter in several disciplines, volunteer Instructor with the Boy Scouts, Board Member of C4SNJ, and an Associate Member of the Second Amendment Women Shooting Club.  I BLEED the Second Amendment as it is.

 

So how many others are here that won't care that they'll have to explain on a form why they were denied a permit to carry?

 

Here's the count so far:

 

1.  Dave (Smokin' .50)

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Do you think there is a way someone can organize an event or class where we all go fill out everything have a notary there. Do qualifications prints ect. Make it easy for people to apply. A one stop shop. Something similar to what ranges do for florida ccw permits. Just an idea.

 

It already exists - Shooters on Target - Try their next "Multi-State CCW" class.  One class covers  FL, UT, VA & AZ, including training (including live fire portion), fingerprinting, forms and Notary services (but not State fees). It meets at the Quinton Sportsmen;s Club, Salem, NJ.

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It already exists - Shooters on Target - Try their next "Multi-State CCW" class.  One class covers  FL, UT, VA & AZ, including training (including live fire portion), fingerprinting, forms and Notary services (but not State fees). It meets at the Quinton Sportsmen;s Club, Salem, NJ.

I mean a class to apply for nj ccw.

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^^I'm not sure.  Let's see who is willing to go the distance....  Why don't YOU do the organizing?  I'm already a Certified Instructor, CRSO, Mentor, Hunter, Discipline Chair, Competitive Shooter in several disciplines, volunteer Instructor with the Boy Scouts, Board Member of C4SNJ, and an Associate Member of the Second Amendment Women Shooting Club.  I BLEED the Second Amendment as it is.

 

So how many others are here that won't care that they'll have to explain on a form why they were denied a permit to carry?

 

Here's the count so far:

 

1.  Dave (Smokin' .50)

dave im going to contact a local range and see if i can get something going. Im willing to apply and think it would be nice and easy if we can get a one stop shop to help people apply. I should be able to qualify for justifiable need although i probably wont get it so it may help strengthen the case. I dont really care if i have to fill out i was denied because of lack of justifiable need and neither should anybody else. But as you said who is actually willing to we need some sort of list to gauge interest. i will keep you posted.

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Does it make sense to check with ANJRPC on the mass-application before reinventing the wheel.  We need some serious lawyer-type discussions before jumping into the waters. I havent seen the usual members comment on thread, they know something we dont ?

 

Interestingly, I checked Almeida gofundme page. That page raised all of $1483, a drop in the bucket.  Some obvious numbers:

 

$100 from 1000 people is 100K. 

$100 from 10000 people is 1 mil.

 

How many are willing to give up one long gun from their collection for some serious class action suit ? It could rival Mr. Bloomberg donation, but I doubt many in NJ are that serious about 2A and concealed carry.

 

It would seem that on average there were no more than 14 people willing to give $100 each to Almedia.

 

My justifiable need is "Self Defense" and second amendment. Not sure if that qualifies (?) but count me in. I will bring some dough too.

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Does it make sense to check with ANJRPC on the mass-application before reinventing the wheel.  We need some serious lawyer-type discussions before jumping into the waters. I havent seen the usual members comment on thread, they know something we dont ?

 

Interestingly, I checked Almeida gofundme page. That page raised all of $1483, a drop in the bucket.  Some obvious numbers:

 

$100 from 1000 people is 100K. 

$100 from 10000 people is 1 mil.

 

How many are willing to give up one long gun from their collection for some serious class action suit ? It could rival Mr. Bloomberg donation, but I doubt many in NJ are that serious about 2A and concealed carry.

 

It would seem that on average there were no more than 14 people willing to give $100 each to Almedia.

 

My justifiable need is "Self Defense" and second amendment. Not sure if that qualifies (?) but count me in. I will bring some dough too.

IM a step ahead of you. I contacted anjrpc about this this morning along with another local range to see. waiting for replies to see what we can get going. No sense in doing it if anjrpc or another big backer isn't willing to take a case and help us with this.

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Guys, Dave is right.

 

I would be #2 on that list. 

 

Don't buy the myth that you will be turned down for FID/PPP. In fact if that is the case it can only help us. 

 

We need to reorganize and strategize. NJ2AS had a list for people willing to submit a carry app and only about 50 signed up.

 

The turnout in NJ is piss poor.

We wouldn't have been talking about this, nor the 10 round limit, nor any of the other anti-gun bills if we had gotten out en masse last year and voted the bums out. If Sweeney was out on his ass and maybe even Weinberg (although I do admit that is a heavy lift) you know that they would scurry and run for cover? We would rule the state.

 

We need committed people and we need the numbers. NOW. Not tomorrow. 

 

It is crystal clear that the court system is not going to save us. Some white knight isn't going to come in and save us. WE need to do this for ourselves.

 

Don't even think it's just about someone and their "john wayne fantasy." In Chicago/Illinois when they got their right to carry the whole anti gun establishment went into full retreat. We can do it if people just WAKE UP!!!

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IM a step ahead of you. I contacted anjrpc about this this morning along with another local range to see. waiting for replies to see what we can get going. No sense in doing it if anjrpc or another big backer isn't willing to take a case and help us with this.

 

My opinion is that Scott Bach won't touch this unless we get serious commitment or another case in another state/circuit resolved in our favor, like Peruta. 

 

But we do need to organize. We can't just have 5-10 or a few hundred people. It must be thousands. We should be shutting down Trenton and they must fear our power as a voting bloc. 

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Do you think there is a way someone can organize an event or class where we all go fill out everything have a notary there. Do qualifications prints ect. Make it easy for people to apply. A one stop shop. Something similar to what ranges do for florida ccw permits. Just an idea.

 

Hmm.

 

I am thinking of becoming a notary... Just have to contact LD24 to get their endorsement. I would volunteer to help out. 

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