where to find more training

[scomike 0]

not sure if this is where it should be posted, sorry in advance to the mods if its not... im new to the forum.

 

i am on the job where carying is part of our every day lives, both on and off duty. with that said almost no training is offered other than an amual requalify shoot.

 

i am really looking for some training with the weapon for both use and acurcy, i do go to the range and blow off rounds and i feel like standing there shooting at a target doesnt really give you anything but muscle memory.. is there any places out there that offer tactical type training where you actually move or have different targets to shoot at(something to make you think while you shoot)

 

thank you

[67gtonut 847]

http://rtsponline.com/#

 

http://gunforhire.com/

 

http://www.sigsaueracademy.com/

 

just for starters.....

 

Others will post more links....

[mag1 0]

http://aliastraining.com/larryvickers1911operatorsclass-nov15-162014-wallingfordct.aspx

 

My buddy and I will be at this one.

[Mr.Stu 1,916]

Consider trying your hand at IDPA. There are matches almost every weekend if you're willing to travel a bit. Training courses are obviously a good thing but repetition will build skills that you can call on if/when you need to.

 

IDPA is the International Defensive Pistol Association and was created as an action shooting sport which more closely mimics defensive use of a handgun than USPSA. It is still a game and some of the rules are in contention with some tactical training but it will get you shooting on the move, at multiple targets, under the pressure of having a timer running. Plus it is a heck of a lot of fun.

 

Do a search on youtube to see some footage of the kind of things we get up to.

 

Sent from my SCH-I800 using Tapatalk 2

 

 

[Smokin .50 1,907]

not sure if this is where it should be posted, sorry in advance to the mods if its not... im new to the forum.

 

i am on the job where carying is part of our every day lives, both on and off duty. with that said almost no training is offered other than an amual requalify shoot.

 

i am really looking for some training with the weapon for both use and acurcy, i do go to the range and blow off rounds and i feel like standing there shooting at a target doesnt really give you anything but muscle memory.. is there any places out there that offer tactical type training where you actually move or have different targets to shoot at(something to make you think while you shoot)

 

thank you

Mr.Stu hit the nail on the head!

 

Pick your Gun Game and use your Duty or off-duty gun to shoot the Match.  I'd also recommend IDPA to start-out with, since you need to both shoot and reload from behind cover (more real-world than pepper poppers and the infamous "Texas Star" used in USPSA).  Join a club that hosts IDPA Matches, go make some friends.  Check yer Ego at the door, because you'll get yer ass kicked by guys and gals who shoot every weekend instead of just twice a year!  Learn by OSMOSIS and asking lots of questions (it's O-K, we EXPECT to be asked).  Have FUN as you see both your times and accuracy improve.  Lastly, remember it's a GAME, so be prepared for a little friendly competition once you get better at gun handling.  And THANK-YOU for posting your inquiry.  Everybody here wants you to shoot as good as you possibly can, especially since we've all been neutered and can't CCW in the People's Republic of New Jerseystan.........

 

Phillipsburg, Easton, Somerset and Old Bridge all host IDPA Matches.  So does the club in Winslow.  Might be a couple more I forgot to list.  Let us know which one ya wanna show up to and we'll introduce you to the Match Director of the club you wish to visit.  Several members here go to more than one Match a month (at several clubs mentioned).

 

Take care and hope to see ya around soon!

 

Dave

[Vlad G 345]

I would be remiss if I let those two monopolize the conversation with IDPA

 

Try ALL the shooting games that can be shot with your duty gear. Training is a awesome idea but unless you can afford for pay for training weekly, getting into the action pistol (and rifle, and shotgun) sports is to my biased mind the best way to keep up your proficiency.  Remember that you can shoot each scenario that game way or the tactical way, you can get what you want out of it, you can ignore the game score and use the scenario for your own purposes.

 

Years back we had a ICE agent who was shooting USPSA with us, in full kit, including body armor, in the middle of summer in 90F. To him, that made sense.

 

IF we can convince you try the action games we play and that they won't "get you killed on the street", I recommend you first try Static Steel matches, then IDPA, the USPSA. I'm going to say something that will be taken out of context, but roughly that is also the skill set progression. Steel is simple and fast, no movement, accuracy is set to mediocre depending the speed you go to.  IDPA adds movement, scripted scenario's, reloads, accuracy matters a lot more now. USPSA then adds freestyle (you choose how you shoot a stage, not the rule book), extra speed, longer stages, more ammo per stage/match, shots that can be a bit more technical and challenging.

 

All of this depends greatly from club to club as well.

 

And then there is 3gun, but we'll leave that out for now.

 

However, talk the other LEO's here (specially HE) and see what courses the recommend best suited to the job, as they are likely to get you the most concentrated injection of job specific knowledge. The gun games are for honing firearm manipulation and movement, not for learning tactics.

[67gtonut 847]

Yeah..... 

 

I will agree, the gun games are perfect for the physical aspect of training....

 

but get some Tactical Training also...... you need the Mental Training as well.....

[scomike 0]

Thank you all for the input. I used to live in Jackson and would go shoot at a range in lakewood, but now live in columbus in Burlington county, are there any ranges, or guys in this area, or IDPA matches I can go check out?

[Smokin .50 1,907]

Vlad makes great sense (as usual).  The progression from Steel to USPSA also makes sense.

 

For local club info I'd go to the IDPA web site and click on both NJ and PA to see what's near Columbus.  Also check the USPSA web site to do the same.

 

www.idpa.com 

 

www.uspsa.org  

 

The Old Bridge club hosts both leagues, two Sundays apart:

 

www.obcats.com  

 

www.obdogs.com   

 

Central Jersey Rifle and Pistol Club does USPSA.  Vlad is the Match Director.  They are the largest and nicest club that's close to you.  Their USPSA Match is open to the public (membership in the host club is NOT required, but does make it easier to practice).  And they do Steel as well (but you might have to be a member to do it--steel--check with Vlad).

 

Enjoy perusing all of those sites and check you-tube for Match videos.

 

Dave

[Mikeythumbs 1]

Smokin the steel match on the first Sunday of the month is open to all at CJ. It is the third Sunday steel that is members only and at old bridge they have at least two steel a month static and Knockdown

[Mr.Stu 1,916]

A great resource is www.nepaidpascores.net

 

Walt is in the process of stepping down but for now you can easily find many of the active clubs in the region for IDPA, USPSA, ICORE, etc.

 

Sent from my SCH-I800 using Tapatalk 2

 

 

[Smokin .50 1,907]

Smokin the steel match on the first Sunday of the month is open to all at CJ. It is the third Sunday steel that is members only and at old bridge they have at least two steel a month static and Knockdown

 

Thanks for the correction Mikey!

 

Old Bridge's Knockdown Steel is the 2nd Saturday.  Static Steel runs on the 1st and 3rd Sundays in the same time slot as Shotgun and Black Powder Leagues, so LOTS of lead to pump, lol!

 

Dave

[High Exposure 5,662]

Keep in mind there are three areas you need to train:

 

Shooting (marksmanship, manipulations, gun handling)

Tactics, techniques, procedures (TTPs)

Mindset

 

Make sure the training you attend is relevant to your needs/job. An IDPA competitor will have different training needs and goals than a soldier, who will have different training needs than a patrol Cop, whose training needs are different than a CCW/HD/armed citizen, whose training needs will be different than a detective/plain clothes guy, whose needs will be different than a SWAT Cop, whose needs will be different than a Brinks Truck driver, etc.....

 

There will be some overlap, for example marksmanship and gun handling will be similar but TTPs, equipment, drawstroke, mindset, ROE (military) or Constitutional UoF (LE), will be quite different.

 

It may take a different set of skills to win an IDPA match than a USPSA match than a Steel Challenge event. Defending your home is not the same as preventing a car jacking. Responding to a hold up alarm in a solo car is different than responding to a hostage job with 12 partners.

 

Make sure your selected trainer is credible, their knowledge base is relevant and current, that they will back your training if you ever need to use it, and they have some real world experience. In my experience an instructor whose creds are mostly comprised of taking other instructor's courses and "memberships" to other organizations that require a fee for acceptance should be avoided. They are the self-licking ice cream cones of the training world.

 

Gun Games are games, they can be fun practice - they are not training (Unless winning at the gun games is your ultimate goal). There is a difference - make sure you know it and can seperate it, especially of you carry a gun daily.

[Vlad G 345]

Yep, HE is right, but again I'll mention that you can shoot IDPA or USPSA in a way that gets you jack for match score but matches your needs.  You don't need to shoot to win the game, you can shoot to practice your skills and tactics. Think of it as 6-7 shoot house scenario's that someone else built for you. As long as you follow the safety rules we have, who cares if you get penalties for not following the course description, shoot it as you would if your life depended on it. 

 

I need get HE out to one of our matches. He almost bit on the rifle match. 

[High Exposure 5,662]

Agreed 100% on all counts Vlad!

[acaixguard 37]

http://aliastraining.com/larryvickers1911operatorsclass-nov15-162014-wallingfordct.aspx

 

My buddy and I will be at this one.

 

I'm all for a class by LAV...having taken 2 of his classes before, I can attest to how worthwhile they are.

 

However, why are you suggesting a class that focuses on the 1911?

[HBecwithFn7 296]

I see that there are a good number of options available for RSO and RO training (IDPA, USPSA, etc.). However, other than the NRA, are there other options for "weapons instructor" training (I.e. if you want to teach weapons training to other students)?  I'm not saying I wouldn't want the NRA curriculum. I'm just saying they are the only one's I've seen with "Instructor Trainer" training... Just looking for something with which to compare...

 

 

 

 

 

[Mr.Stu 1,916]

I see that there are a good number of options available for RSO and RO training (IDPA, USPSA, etc.). However, other than the NRA, are there other options for "weapons instructor" training (I.e. if you want to teach weapons training to other students)? I'm not saying I wouldn't want the NRA curriculum. I'm just saying they are the only one's I've seen with "Instructor Trainer" training... Just looking for something with which to compare...

I'm not aware of anything that gets national recognition like NRA instructor does that is available to the public. I shoot with a NJ State Trooper who is an instructor for the state police but I guess he had to do extra training at the police academy for that.

 

The NRA instructor course comes in two parts. First is Basic Instructor Training (BIT) which teaches you how to teach. Then you do the discipline specific course which teaches you what to teach.

 

BIT is useful whether you are teaching an NRA curriculum or anything else.

 

Once you have an NRA instructor rating you can self teach NRA RSO.

 

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[mag1 0]

I'm all for a class by LAV...having taken 2 of his classes before, I can attest to how worthwhile they are.

 

However, why are you suggesting a class that focuses on the 1911?

scomike did not mention which pistol he is training with, so suggested LAV in case it is a 1911.

I  am making my way to the 6 day build a 1911 class with him and Burton, should  be one hell of an experience.

[checko 180]

scomike did not mention which pistol he is training with, so suggested LAV in case it is a 1911.

I am making my way to the 6 day build a 1911 class with him and Burton, should be one hell of an experience.

Nice! I would love to do that.

 

Sent from my XT1080 using Tapatalk

 

 

[Mikeythumbs 1]

scomike did not mention which pistol he is training with, so suggested LAV in case it is a 1911.

I am making my way to the 6 day build a 1911 class with him and Burton, should be one hell of an experience.

 

That would be a dream class for me on the bucket list.

[Sandy 44]

Agreed 100% on all counts Vlad!

 

Yep, HE is right, but again I'll mention that you can shoot IDPA or USPSA in a way that gets you jack for match score but matches your needs.  You don't need to shoot to win the game, you can shoot to practice your skills and tactics. Think of it as 6-7 shoot house scenario's that someone else built for you. As long as you follow the safety rules we have, who cares if you get penalties for not following the course description, shoot it as you would if your life depended on it. 

 

I need get HE out to one of our matches. He almost bit on the rifle match. 

That is why I like IDPA , it is a great supplemental affordable way to train.It is good mental exercise , drawing , using cover , accuracy complete with innocents that you can't shoot..  moving targets. I compete against myself only and I  get WAY more down on myself for hitting no shoots , failure to neutralizes and such than I do about being 100 seconds slower across 8 stages than the best in my class. Safety , accuracy , and no "bad" mistakes are my goal. If the winning comes later so be it .

 

I can't stress enough how important actual tactical training is though. If you want to be trained for a situation where you are attacked and under stress , your significant other and or kids are screaming , and someone is trying to take your gun away from you because you missed them with 10 rounds while they were charging up your steps in the dark , you really do need to plonk down on some tactical courses. I highly recommend Gun For Hire's CCW course as starters. It is about an hour and 15 from where you are and usually no traffic once the Bennies go home. You can eat there and have a cigar in the FU Bloomberg  lounge too.

 

I like SIMS classes too. If you have not trained frightened , you are not as trained as you think you are.

[mag1 0]

That would be a dream class for me on the bucket list.

Me too. Finally decided to do it

[ISA5 0]

Consider the courses offered in Israel by the Israeli Security Academy. The Israeli Tactical Response methods course covers allot of pistol techniques that the Israelis have mastered in their expertise in the field of security and counter terrorism. 

 

http://www.securityacademy.com/home.html

 

 

[Sandy 44]

I see there is one in Switzerland in June of 2015...

[High Exposure 5,662]

Consider the courses offered in Israel by the Israeli Security Academy. The Israeli Tactical Response methods course covers allot of pistol techniques that the Israelis have mastered in their expertise in the field of security and counter terrorism.

 

http://www.securityacademy.com/home.html

[checko 180]

Consider the courses offered in Israel by the Israeli Security Academy. The Israeli Tactical Response methods course covers allot of pistol techniques that the Israelis have mastered in their expertise in the field of security and counter terrorism.

 

http://www.securityacademy.com/home.html

[High Exposure 5,662]

[ISA5 0]

There is one in Israel in May and its pretty relevant to advancing your training and skill set both armed and unarmed. it is pretty well known that Krav maga is an extremely effective easy to learn combat system and frankly the Israelis are the best and most experienced fighters in deterrence and self defense. I know myself that the Israelis are doing it right so I think its worth it to consider learning some of their techniques, anyways, just a suggestion...

[Vlad G 345]

There is one in Israel in May and its pretty relevant to advancing your training and skill set both armed and unarmed. it is pretty well known that Krav maga is an extremely effective easy to learn combat system and frankly the Israelis are the best and most experienced fighters in deterrence and self defense. I know myself that the Israelis are doing it right so I think its worth it to consider learning some of their techniques, anyways, just a suggestion...

 

Why don't you pitch your product harder? I'm not convinced yet, Have you tried a 2am infomercial?