trying to buy first gun p2p from out of state

[sushiweed24 0]

I'm a 21 year old with a clean background but I'm a little confused on some legal issues regarding purchasing my first gun.

I'm a New Jersey resident, working in Alaska for the summer. I've been looking on Alaskaslist to purchase a handgun from a private dealer. But I know New Jersey has some strict laws on bringing firearms to the state. I was wondering if it's entirely legal for me to fly a handgun from Alaska to New Jersey after buying from a private dealer. 

thanks

[ogfarmer 138]

You can't buy a handgun in Alaska if your a NJ resident and take possesion of it while in Alaska. Federal law prohibits it. The dealer or person would have to ship it to a NJ FFL and then you would have to go to the NJ dealer with your Permit to Purchase a handgun, Drivers license, (Most dealers will also require your Firearms Purchasers ID also). and then fill out all necessary paper work in order to take possession of it.

 

Bottom line is you can pay for it in Alaska but can't take possession of it in Alaska only in NJ

[ogfarmer 138]

 

1. Handgun purchases by

....A. NJ resident from

........(1) NJ dealer = NICS check with a P2P and Photo ID

........(2) NJ resident = face to face with a P2P with Photo ID suggested

........(3) Out-of-state dealer = must be transferred through NJ dealer - Refer 1A(1)

........(4) Out-of-state resident = must be transferred through NJ dealer - Refer 1A(1)

....B. Out-of-state resident from

........(1) NJ dealer = must be transferred through buyer's home state dealer

........(2) NJ resident = must be transferred through buyer's home state dealer

 

2. Long gun purchases by

....A. NJ resident from

........(1) NJ dealer = NICS check with a FPID, COE and Photo ID

........(2) NJ resident = face to face with a FPID, COE with Photo ID suggested

........(3) Out-of-state dealer = NICS check with a FPID, COE and Photo ID

........(4) Out-of-state resident = must be transferred through

............a. NJ dealer = NICS check with a FPID, COE and Photo ID or

............b. Out-of-state dealer = NICS check with a FPID, COE and Photo ID

....B. Non-resident from

........(1) NJ dealer = NICS check with a FPID, COE and Photo ID

........(2) NJ resident = must be transferred through

............a. NJ dealer = NICS check with a FPID, COE and Photo ID or

............b. Out-of-state dealer = consult buyer's home state laws

[sushiweed24 0]

So is my best bet just waiting to go back to Jersey and getting  my first gun there? seems like a lot of hassle buying it in alaska

[ogfarmer 138]

Waiting to come back to NJ is your only option in order to take possession of it.

 

Do you have a NJ Firearms Purchasers ID already? If not you will need to apply for it also. EDIT- (In order to purchase handgun ammo while in NJ or thru some online retailers)

 

You will also have to apply for Permits to Purchase a Handgun when you return in order to buy one. They are only good for 90 days. But can be extended for additional 90 which is discretionary to issuing authority. And you can only purchase 1 handgun a month.

[JT Custom Guns 956]

Actually you can buy the gun while in Alaska, and then have the seller

ship it to your FFL in NJ.

Upon your arrival back in NJ, you can complete the transfer by taking possession

of the weapon from your FFL.

 

There is one stipulation, and that is if you buy from a private seller in Alaska, 

you will need to verify that your FFL in NJ will accept a transfer from a Non- FFL.

Some dealer in NJ will not - We do accept this type of transfer as long as the seller

includes a clear / readable copy of his/hers drivers lic with a photo.

 

If we can be of service - call me to discuss.

good Luck!

JT

[Pizza Bob 1,488]

Waiting to come back to NJ is your only option.

 

Do you have a NJ Firearms Purchasers ID already? If not you will need to apply for it also.

 

You will also have to apply for Permits to Purchase a Handgun when you return in order to buy one. They are only good for 90 days.

 

You do not need a FPID in order to purchase a handgun - just a Permit to Purchase (P2P) & a DL w/matching address.

 

That being said, it only makes sense to get both simultaneously, since the process is the same and can be done simultaneously on the same form (STS-033), just check the appropriate boxes at the top of the form. Beside that, you will need an FPID if you intend to purchase handgun ammunition in the state and from some on-line vendors.

 

The process is documented in Post #1 of this thread...

 

http://njgunforums.com/forum/index.php/topic/68599-fpid-p2p-application-process/

 

HTH

 

Adios,

 

Pizza Bob

[ogfarmer 138]

Pizza Bob thanks --- Oops I forgot to add "to buy pistol ammo in NJ" to that sentence. Also I was generally asking if he had one in case he didn't know about them.

[Carcano 14]

Federal Law requires handguns purchased out of state be sent to a licensed dealer (in this case, a FFL dealer in New Jersey) the handgun can be shipped by a private party but check with the New Jersey FFL you decide to use as many will not accept firearms from non FFL's for transfer.

 

If the private party is shipping the handgun it must be shipped UPS and Fedex and via Overnight or 2nd Day Air.

 

You cannot ship a handgun via the United States Postal Service (USPS) unless you are a FFL, only FFL's can mail a handgun Priority Mail from one dealer to another.

 

However, If you have a Alaska DL and do not perm. reside in New Jersey you could purchase the handgun legally in Alaska and fly it back. You will need to contact the airline and verify they have no policy preventing firearms from being transported. Needs to be in a locked approved case and arrive at the airport early to declare it. DO NOT ATTEMPT TO PACK IT IN A CARRY ON BAG! THAT'S A FELONY JUST WAITING TO HAPPEN.

[Mikeythumbs 1]

You can get a p2p without a FID? I didn't know that

[Carcano 14]

You can get a p2p without a FID? I didn't know that

 

I think you can, I have a relative who has a P2P and a pistol but never had a FPID, this was obtained in the 90's but the form is the same.

 

I can't see why someone wouldn't just get the FPID while applying for the P2P???

[Mikeythumbs 1]

I think you can, I have a relative who has a P2P and a pistol but never had a FPID, this was obtained in the 90's but the form is the same.

 

I can't see why someone wouldn't just get the FPID while applying for the P2P???

Doesn't the permit require you did number though what do you fill in for that part

[Blacksmythe 71]

Went to the Bullet Hole with a valid permit and they claimed I needed the FID along with it to complete the sale of a pistol and that its not allowed any more to just have a permit.......So who knows? This was as recent as April 2014. I asked if it was store policy. They said it was a state thing. So did I get conned or was this another "store rule" and the fellow making it up as they go along?

[Carcano 14]

Doesn't the permit require you did number though what do you fill in for that part

 

I have no idea how he obtained it without that, I think it was left blank.

 

Went to the Bullet Hole with a valid permit and they claimed I needed the FID along with it to complete the sale of a pistol and that its not allowed any more to just have a permit.......So who knows? This was as recent as April 2014. I asked if it was store policy. They said it was a state thing. So did I get conned or was this another "store rule" and the fellow making it up as they go along?

 

It's possible (or was possible) to obtain a P2P without a FPID, in my relatives case he had a pistol shipped to a dealer from a family members estate and obtained his P2P without the FPID as he has never done any hunting, taget shooting, etc. so no need for long guns.

 

Of course that was in the 90's.

 

If unsure, call (609) 882-2000 ext 2060 and someone at NJSP FIU can probably give a better (detailed) answer on how to go about this.

[Mikeythumbs 1]

I have no idea how he obtained it without that, I think it was left blank.

 

 

It's possible (or was possible) to obtain a P2P without a FPID, in my relatives case he had a pistol shipped to a dealer from a family members estate and obtained his P2P without the FPID as he has never done any hunting, taget shooting, etc. so no need for long guns.

 

Of course that was in the 90's.

 

If unsure, call (609) 882-2000 ext 2060 and someone at NJSP FIU can probably give a better (detailed) answer on how to go about this

 

I was just very supprised not doubting it happened but you are right why get the P2P and not get the FID at the same time 

[Carcano 14]

 

I have no idea how he obtained it without that, I think it was left blank.

 

 

It's possible (or was possible) to obtain a P2P without a FPID, in my relatives case he had a pistol shipped to a dealer from a family members estate and obtained his P2P without the FPID as he has never done any hunting, taget shooting, etc. so no need for long guns.

 

Of course that was in the 90's.

 

If unsure, call (609) 882-2000 ext 2060 and someone at NJSP FIU can probably give a better (detailed) answer on how to go about this

 

I was just very supprised not doubting it happened but you are right why get the P2P and not get the FID at the same time 

 

 

Some people might want a pistol and have no need for or interest in rifles/shotguns, I know a few folks that only have pistols for HD and no long guns but of course they got the FPID at the same time as the P2P.

 

I guess if you really want just a single firearm (pistol) you can still obtain a P2P with no FPID but the FPID might come in handy someday if you ever decide to get into long guns.

[Malsua 1,422]

It seems to me the easiest thing to do would be to become a resident of Alaska, then stay there and visit NJ once in a while if there's something still drawing you back.  The sooner you cut the cord, the better off you'll be.

[Mikeythumbs 1]

Some people might want a pistol and have no need for or interest in rifles/shotguns, I know a few folks that only have pistols for HD and no long guns but of course they got the FPID at the same time as the P2P.

 

I guess if you really want just a single firearm (pistol) you can still obtain a P2P with no FPID but the FPID might come in handy someday if you ever decide to get into long guns.

Or buy ammo for said handgun in nj. 

[Carcano 14]

It seems to me the easiest thing to do would be to become a resident of Alaska, then stay there and visit NJ once in a while if there's something still drawing you back.  The sooner you cut the cord, the better off you'll be.

 

Bingo! if the OP could do this he could avoid the NJ P2P and all of the nonsense.

 

Or buy ammo for said handgun in nj. 

 

Yep, I guess if you want just a pistol and a box of 50 shells to keep in the house the P2P without FPID would be fine. But hey, while sitting at the local PD filling out the form it's worth checking off the box for FPID

[PD2K 115]

1. Do you have your NJ FID?

2. Do you have a pistol permit (aka P2P)?

 

If you have both, you can purchase the handgun in AK, but it MUST be shipped directly to a NJ FFL in order for your to take possession (and process the paperwork).

[HBecwithFn7 296]

Or buy ammo for said handgun in nj. 

 

And that's the thing... You might not need the FID to purchase the handgun in NJ, but you need it to purchase "handgun" ammo. Unless you're just going to purchase the handgun and not shoot it ?!?

 

To the OP - A lot depends on the costs... If you believe you can get that gun much cheaper in AK than in NJ, taking all the shipping and transfer costs into account (taxes don't matter because you'd still be liable for "NJ Use Tax" on your NJ-1040), then go ahead and purchase it in AK and have it sent by FFL transfer as described above. But I doubt seriously you'll be able to get it *that* cheaper. I would check this board and make quote requests or inquiries with some of the FFLs on this board. Once you return to NJ, then I'd make the purchase (I assume you'd have all your required docs ready P2Ps etc.). I think you'll find it's much easier.

[DeerSlayer 241]

It seems to me the easiest thing to do would be to become a resident of Alaska, then stay there and visit NJ once in a while if there's something still drawing you back. The sooner you cut the cord, the better off you'll be.

^^^^ I second this idea. Don't even look back.

[Carcano 14]

^^^^ I second this idea. Don't even look back.

 

And buy as many as you can before moving back to PRNJ

[mipafox 438]

You may already be a resident of Alaska during the time you reside there. I know if you owned property in both states you would be for firearms purchases purposes (ATF, FFL, Fuck Jersey, etc.) Not sure about renting.

[Carcano 14]

You may already be a resident of Alaska during the time you reside there. I know if you owned property in both states you would be for firearms purchases purposes (ATF, FFL, Fuck Jersey, etc.) Not sure about renting.

 

Now I have this craving to buy some run down trailer and put it on a plot in Alaska or PA or DE to avoid the firearms BS...

[Oakridgefirearms 224]

You may already be a resident of Alaska during the time you reside there. I know if you owned property in both states you would be for firearms purchases purposes (ATF, FFL, Fuck Jersey, etc.) Not sure about renting.

You need to have a "residence" in whatever state you are buying in as a dual resident. Owning property is not sufficient to be a resident, but it also not required, you need to have a "home" there that you are using. You could rent a house or an apartment and be a resident, or conversely, you could own land or a house that you are renting out to someone else and not be a resident there.

 

You also can only make purchases as a resident when you are actually "residing" at that particular house. So if you owned a home in NJ and PA, it would be illegal to travel from your NJ home to PA, buy a handgun there as a resident, and then go directly back to NJ. How exactly the ATF defines "residing" I don't know.

[HBecwithFn7 296]

You need to have a "residence" in whatever state you are buying in as a dual resident. Owning property is not sufficient to be a resident, but it also not required, you need to have a "home" there that you are using. You could rent a house or an apartment and be a resident, or conversely, you could own land or a house that you are renting out to someone else and not be a resident there.

 

You also can only make purchases as a resident when you are actually "residing" at that particular house. So if you owned a home in NJ and PA, it would be illegal to travel from your NJ home to PA, buy a handgun there as a resident, and then go directly back to NJ. How exactly the ATF defines "residing" I don't know.

 

Most likely, the place of your "primary domicile" (i.e. where you are registered to vote, from where you file your taxes as a "resident," the location printed on your DL, etc.)... Hopefully, all of which are the same.   For tax purposes, I believe you must live in the "primary domicile" state for at least 183 days to be considered a "resident" that tax year. Yes, you can own property in both states and rent one out, but it's where you are living that counts. Keep those grocery and fuel receipts so you can prove you lived there (utility bills probably wouldn't be sufficient).

[Malsua 1,422]

Most likely, the place of your "primary domicile" (i.e. where you are registered to vote, from where you file your taxes as a "resident," the location printed on your DL, etc.)... Hopefully, all of which are the same.   For tax purposes, I believe you must live in the "primary domicile" state for at least 183 days to be considered a "resident" that tax year. Yes, you can own property in both states and rent one out, but it's where you are living that counts. Keep those grocery and fuel receipts so you can prove you lived there (utility bills probably wouldn't be sufficient).

 

From the various readings I've done on this subject, the key component is intent.  It's "your home" and you plan on living there and the evidence supports it.   You open a bank account, sign up for the local Rotary club, or whatever.  If you make it your home, you reside there.  If you swing by once a week for 10 minutes to pick up mail, you don't reside there.

 

The guy in Alaska who is sleeping in a motel room or flophouse so he can work for the summer isn't a resident.   If he "moves in", even if he will move out later, he's a resident.   Of course you need some government proof, like an ID card to buy from a dealer, but person to person there is no paperwork required.  If he's making himself a resident, which would include things like getting your mail forwarded or signing an apt lease(even if it's month to month), then he's a resident.

[Oakridgefirearms 224]

Most likely, the place of your "primary domicile" (i.e. where you are registered to vote, from where you file your taxes as a "resident," the location printed on your DL, etc.)... Hopefully, all of which are the same.   For tax purposes, I believe you must live in the "primary domicile" state for at least 183 days to be considered a "resident" that tax year. Yes, you can own property in both states and rent one out, but it's where you are living that counts. Keep those grocery and fuel receipts so you can prove you lived there (utility bills probably wouldn't be sufficient).

The standard to be a resident for gun buying is much lower than for tax purposes. The ATF has a reasonably clear description of this, and you can be a "dual resident" of two or more states if you keep a home in each state.

[HBecwithFn7 296]

The standard to be a resident for gun buying is much lower than for tax purposes. The ATF has a reasonably clear description of this, and you can be a "dual resident" of two or more states if you keep a home in each state.

 

Could you point me in the direction of an URL for that please?  Not that it matters to me. Once I GTFO NJ, I will no longer have need for my FPID, as I would not in tend to buy any further weapons or ammo in NJ for any reason....  In fact, I dare say NJ will not see hyde nor hair of me (and my inventory) again.