AG Graves Act guideline update

[bmfenn 0]

Not sure if anyone posted this yet

http://www.state.nj.us/lps/dcj/agguide/directives/Graves-Act-clarification-2014.pdf /URL]

 

It exempts out of state ccw holders who committed no other crime for graves act sentencing, and recommends pti.

 

Its too bad it didn't go a little farther, and direct law enforcement to not arrest, like the recent guideline expanding the "bonjovi" overdose law. It just directs prosecutors on how to prosecute, or more importantly, to not prosecute.

 

[Howard 538]

So it just re-affirms that NJ citizens will continue to be treated as second class citizens.

[Michael2013 56]

So it just re-affirms that NJ citizens will continue to be treated as second class citizens.

That's exactly what I thought

[71ragtopgoat 23]

No thought needed. We are. God help us all if Christie gets the nomination. He stinks with a capitol S

[ryan_j 0]

Well that's a good thing because it can now be challenged under the 14a. 

[mipafox 438]

Well that's a good thing because it can now be challenged under the 14a. 

You seen what has happened to the courts over the past year? We got two more years of packing the scales of justice.

 

Your challenge will be approved and the guideline will be outlawed. Congratulations. You've helped nobody

[ryan_j 0]

You seen what has happened to the courts over the past year? We got two more years of packing the scales of justice.

 

Your challenge will be approved and the guideline will be outlawed. Congratulations. You've helped nobody

Then so be it. This "fix" is a band aid at best, a day late and a dollar short and if it takes a few more shaneen Allens to permanently fix it then fine.

[Smokin .50 1,907]

Of course the entire statement the AG wrote is unconstitutional on its' face and therefor won't hold water when sumbudy tries to use it as case law.  It's like I've been sayin' all-along on facebook:  "Some Pigs are MORE EQUAL" right outta Animal Farm!  NJ tax payers are henceforth 2nd Class Citizens AND there are now FOUR types of gun possession ranging from Gang-Banger with EVIL and UNLAWFUL intent to the completely ignorant (like Shaneen Allen).

 

IMHO the current state of affairs melted a phone line between the RINO and his AG, with the net outcome that the Governator looks like he's anti-crime and anti-gun enough to have Dems vote for him, while conservatives, given an even lousier option, will be forced to hold their noses and vote for him or waste their votes on a 3rd Party candidate..........

 

Just sayin'.......

[illy 1]

There's no equal protection issue here.

 

The subjects of the AG's clarification of the Graves Act directive are "individuals who are licensed to carry in their state of residence".

It states that such individuals who mistakenly carry in NJ should not be punished as severly as people who knowingly break our stupid, unconstitutional laws.

 

NJ residents who are similarly situated- i.e. have a ccw from their state of residence- woudn't be arrested in the first place.

 

NJ residents who carry but don't have a NJ ccw are completely different.

 

Therefore, no 14th Amendment violation.

[Smokin .50 1,907]

There's no equal protection issue here.

 

The subjects of the AG's clarification of the Graves Act directive are "individuals who are licensed to carry in their state of residence".

It states that such individuals who mistakenly carry in NJ should not be punished as severly as people who knowingly break our stupid, unconstitutional laws.

 

NJ residents who are similarly situated- i.e. have a ccw from their state of residence- woudn't be arrested in the first place.

 

NJ residents who carry but don't have a NJ ccw are completely different.

 

Therefore, no 14th Amendment violation.

 

I beg to disagree on your interpretation of equal protection.  What other set-asides are currently in-place for out-of-staters?  Which state statutes don't apply to felonies committed by non-residents?  Homicide?  AA and B?  Grand Theft?  Rape?  Torture?  Stock trading (Martha Stewart) errors?  DWI with leaving the scene and injury / fatality involved?  Real Estate swindle Laws?  Selling Drugs in sufficient quantity for a felony?  Carjacking?  Murder for hire?   

 

I'm ALL EARS.........   

[mipafox 438]

Then so be it. This "fix" is a band aid at best, a day late and a dollar short and if it takes a few more shaneen Allens to permanently fix it then fine.

That about sums it up.

[ryan_j 0]

There's no equal protection issue here.

 

The subjects of the AG's clarification of the Graves Act directive are "individuals who are licensed to carry in their state of residence".

It states that such individuals who mistakenly carry in NJ should not be punished as severly as people who knowingly break our stupid, unconstitutional laws.

 

NJ residents who are similarly situated- i.e. have a ccw from their state of residence- woudn't be arrested in the first place.

 

NJ residents who carry but don't have a NJ ccw are completely different.

 

Therefore, no 14th Amendment violation.

 

The directive is littered with the words "resident of another state" and "out of state visitor." It is aimed at them. The gist of it is that they are otherwise law abiding citizens, and only for lack of a NJ permit to carry should not be imprisoned for 3.5 years. Well, what about residents, who also lack said permit? We are law abiding citizens too. It's not just me either, Nappen seems to think there may be an equal protection violation here as well. 

[illy 1]

The law (Grave Act) does in fact still apply to out of state residents with CCWs from their home state.

The Graves Act already grants the prosecutor the ability to apply for a waiver of the mandatory minimum sentence in cases where the defendant has shown through the presentation of compelling reasons that applying the mandatory minimum would not serve the interest of justice nor achieve the stated goals of the Act (reducing gun violence).

 

The clarification the AG issued merely explains that if defendant can show that:

A. He/she is a legal firearms owner.

B. Has been issued a license to carry a firearm in his/her home state and

C. His/her carrying of a firearm in NJ was inadvertant and due to a mistake of law.

it will generally be presumed that he/she has provided compelling reasons which warrant application of the waiver.

NJ residents charged with Illegal Possession of a Weapon -Firearm are equally permitted to present "compelling reasons" in support of a request for waiver of the mandatory minimum sentence.

 

What does not apply to NJ residents is "B. Has been issued a license to carry in his/her home state", since possession of a NJ CCW would negate the charges in the first place.

 

For a NJ resident to be granted the same waiver, he/she would have to show some other reason for illegally possessing a firearm. Something like:

 

"I saw a police officer inadvertantly drop his gun as he was getting on his morotcycle at 2:00AM in a pretty rough part of town. I tried to alert him, but he couldn't hear me over sound of the exhaust.

 

Since the area was full of children, sketchy gang bangers types and sketchy gang banger type children, I thought it prudent to secure the firearm on my person before anything bad happened.

As I don't have a cell phone and the area was dangerous, I began walking in the direction of the police station, hoping to come upon a payphone or another police officer so that I could alert the proper authorities and return the firearm to its rightful owner.

 

That's when another officer pulled up and asked me what I was doing in skethcy gang banger neighborhood at 2:00AM. I explained that I had an officer's gun and before I could say why I had it, I found myself tasered and unable to speak.

 

Please note the letters from Pope Francis, Cardinal Dolan and the mother superior at my convent which attest to the fact that I took a vow of honesty which I have never broken since joining the Order of the Blessed Sisters of Charity, Poverty, Peace and Non-Violence in 1949. (All of our charity work is in support of the local, state and national PBA. And the Brady Campaign.)

 

Please also note the letter from my physician which advises that due to my advanced arthritis I wouldn't be able to pull that 12lb NY trigger even if I used all ten fingers."

 

Of course near impossiblity doesn't mean unconstitutional. Just look at our CCW case law.

[illy 1]

I would add, all kidding aside, that if a NJ resident could show that he/ she carried based on a genuine mistake of law, they would prevail in being granted the same waiver.

It's uncommon, but it does happen.

[Smokin .50 1,907]

The directive is littered with the words "resident of another state" and "out of state visitor." It is aimed at them. The gist of it is that they are otherwise law abiding citizens, and only for lack of a NJ permit to carry should not be imprisoned for 3.5 years. Well, what about residents, who also lack said permit? We are law abiding citizens too. It's not just me either, Nappen seems to think there may be an equal protection violation here as well. 

 

I concur.  I've been shooting in NJ for 45 years.  Politicians and the CONNECTED receive CCW permits in NJ.  2nd Class Citizens like ourselves DO NOT!  No matter HOW ya slice it, SOME PIGS ARE MORE EQUAL!  "May Issue" is really "Will NOT issue" even with justifiable need, like direct DEATH THREATS as evidenced in several NJ cases of late!  Shaneen's Law simply exacerbates the current situation with even more CLEAR AS MUD soon-to-be case law IMHO!  But what do I know, I've only been around this issue for 45 years of my life....

 

Dave

Attorney at Fact

Shootist

Realist

[quikz 34]

There's no equal protection issue here.

 

The subjects of the AG's clarification of the Graves Act directive are "individuals who are licensed to carry in their state of residence".

It states that such individuals who mistakenly carry in NJ should not be punished as severly as people who knowingly break our stupid, unconstitutional laws.

 

NJ residents who are similarly situated- i.e. have a ccw from their state of residence- woudn't be arrested in the first place.

 

NJ residents who carry but don't have a NJ ccw are completely different.

 

Therefore, no 14th Amendment violation.

"NJ residents who are similarly situated- i.e. have a ccw from their state of residence- woudn't be arrested in the first place."

 

Who the heck even HAS a NJ "carry permit". Except me, except mine's restricted. Now How the Heck, Does That Play Out?

[vladtepes 1,060]

kind of off topic.. but does anyone know if the gun was returned to her? just curious.. also it is ridiculous that someone out of state gets a pass.. how much more abuse can people take..

[ryan_j 0]

No