NJ CCW, Where are we?

[revenger 473]

What is the current status of any CCW cases that might benefit American's who live with the NJ borders. Anything pending or is our only relief going to be a national reciprocity law.    Checking some of my regular sites that provide this info don't seem to say much.   Have we exhausted all pending cases.

[carl_g 568]

If you want to carry, it seems like the best option right now is to relocate to a state which recognizes the 2nd amendment.

[falcone 89]

There is nothing out there that is gonna help us. You want to carry then then the only way is to move because it's never happening here.

[mipafox 438]

Don't get caught.

[Midwest 28]

 

NJ CCW, Where are we?

 

 

 

Time frame?

 

Stuck in the early 1980's when "Hand Gun Control" , "Million Commie Mommies", and other anti-gun organizations were in existence and very few states had CCW. A time when towns like Morton Grove in Illinois banned handguns. That is where New Jersey is.....stuck in a time warp.

[ryan_j 0]

First post I see on this site is defeatists raising the white flag. SMH. Just move!!! When Tom Wolf (dem) is elected he promises to make PA like NJ with gun laws. The legislature can block him for now, but for how long? 

 

We have cases up and coming. We have to come up with a proper strategy. No it is not over yet, and SAF is on board. We have things going on behind the scenes. Nothing public yet but we're working on things.

 

Other states (California) and DC have cases that could help us.

 

National reciprocity can help us.

 

We scored a win with Shaneen Allen. They are now reviewing cases where people have the book thrown at them for what is at best a technical violation. Doesn't directly help us yet but it opens a door. More importantly it gives us some momentum and shows that we can apply pressure with positive effect.

 

Legislators are now paying attention to CCW where they wouldn't even give us the time of day before. Christie's office is addressing it too with correspondence. 

 

Progress is slow but it is happening. 

 

What do we need? We need to stop the defeatism. We won't win overnight but if we give up we have zero chance of winning. We need the numbers. We need YOU. 

[mipafox 438]

First post I see on this site is defeatists raising the white flag. SMH. Just move!!! When Tom Wolf (dem) is elected he promises to make PA like NJ with gun laws. The legislature can block him for now, but for how long? 

 

Let me get this straight. You think it is more likely Jersey will get CCW and PA, the state with probably the most CCW of any state, will also lose it?

 

OK.

[TonyS. 12]

If you want to carry, it seems like the best option right now is to relocate to a state which recognizes the 2nd amendment.

 

Shouldn't it be, the people recognize the 2nd?

[remixer 1,645]

Let me get this straight. You think it is more likely Jersey will get CCW and PA, the state with probably the most CCW of any state, will also lose it?

 

OK.

 

Prob not for some time.. But problem with living in Any east coast cities are they are moving in more democrats and moving more low income people out of the cities in the the suburbs. At some point it will tip into the dems favor and they will most likely make a gun control move.... Up state Nyers never saw it coming... but look what happened

[mipafox 438]

Prob not for some time.. But problem with living in Any east coast cities are they are moving in more democrats and moving more low income people out of the cities in the the suburbs. At some point it will tip into the dems favor and they will most likely make a gun control move.... Up state Nyers never saw it coming... but look what happened

You are thinking like NJ. No state has reduced carry. You are thinking since NJ doesn't have carry, it's just a matter of time before other states loose it. Even to this day, even this year, everything is moving in the other direction. Towards more freedom of carry.

 

As for NYers, they are a democrat state. Not just by total popular vote, but by county and by district. They probably have a weaker gun culture than Jersey in both respects.

 

PA is Republican and even if you pack another 1 million people into Philly, Bucks, and Montco, and they never vote for another Republican governor or president again, it will still be a Republican state. And it will still be the state with the strongest gun culture and highest number of carry/NRA membership in the US. There is cause for alarm from all the losers from NY and NJ moving in, no doubt. But acting like the Sword of Damocles is over us is silly. It's more likely Texas would turn Dem or pass more anti-gun laws. PA passed pro-gun laws under gun-hating Fast Eddie Rendel, they've passed them since, they are passing them now, and they will pass them in the foreseeable future. As far as anti-gun laws are concerned, for now we are really only concerned about being blindsided by the nibbling laws that are placeholders for future gun control action.

[ryan_j 0]

Let me get this straight. You think it is more likely Jersey will get CCW and PA, the state with probably the most CCW of any state, will also lose it?

 

OK.

 

Never said that. 

 

I do think it is likely that PA will have a 10 round limit and assault weapons ban in the near-ish future. I believe that may-issue and local pre-emption are coming as well, so philly can ban carry like NYC unless you have one of their permits. 

 

I do know that if (when) Wolf is elected, no pro gun laws are going to be signed. 

[intercooler 41]

Pa will vote dem pretty much from now onwards

[ryan_j 0]

Pa will vote dem pretty much from now onwards

 

Pretty much. They don't call the poconos "Bronx West" for nothing.

[carl_g 568]

Jealousy is the root of all evil..

[PK90 3,570]

Jealousy is the root of all evil..

I thought that the love of money was.

[71ragtopgoat 23]

Spending a good amount of time in the Poconos the last 25 years or so. I can tell you that the democratic welfare state has taken hold. PA now has a very pro ban AG in statewide office.

The tide is turning .

[remixer 1,645]

You are thinking like NJ. No state has reduced carry. You are thinking since NJ doesn't have carry, it's just a matter of time before other states loose it. Even to this day, even this year, everything is moving in the other direction. Towards more freedom of carry.

 

As for NYers, they are a democrat state. Not just by total popular vote, but by county and by district. They probably have a weaker gun culture than Jersey in both respects.

 

PA is Republican and even if you pack another 1 million people into Philly, Bucks, and Montco, and they never vote for another Republican governor or president again, it will still be a Republican state. And it will still be the state with the strongest gun culture and highest number of carry/NRA membership in the US. There is cause for alarm from all the losers from NY and NJ moving in, no doubt. But acting like the Sword of Damocles is over us is silly. It's more likely Texas would turn Dem or pass more anti-gun laws. PA passed pro-gun laws under gun-hating Fast Eddie Rendel, they've passed them since, they are passing them now, and they will pass them in the foreseeable future. As far as anti-gun laws are concerned, for now we are really only concerned about being blindsided by the nibbling laws that are placeholders for future gun control action.

I guess well see

Its not the total number of people that move in ..... Its where they move.

[71ragtopgoat 23]

Yes Philly . Pitt Harisburg and a few other areas are going deep blue. From there it spreads Obama will make sure of that before his time is done.

[remixer 1,645]

HUD is telling local zone boards that cant limit Certain types of buildings... They are actively trying to succeeding in turning the suburbs into the cities especially since the cities are losing revenue due to the flight of people.

 

All in the name of fairness.  

[carl_g 568]

I hate fairness.

[mipafox 438]

 

Never said that. 

 

I do think it is likely that PA will have a 10 round limit and assault weapons ban in the near-ish future. I believe that may-issue and local pre-emption are coming as well, so philly can ban carry like NYC unless you have one of their permits. 

 

I do know that if (when) Wolf is elected, no pro gun laws are going to be signed. 

 

Please spread that rumor far and wide

 

And, I will make sure to point out to you the first pro-gun bill passed under Wolf.

 

 

Pa will vote dem pretty much from now onwards

 

 

Dems will never control the Senate and House in my lifetime in PA. Who they vote for president is not my concern, and governor is only slight concern.

 

Jealousy is the root of all evil..

 

It really is sad.

When is the last time I was rooting for my NJ brethren to lose their rights? I want carry in NJ like nobody's business.

[remixer 1,645]

Dems will never control the Senate and House in my lifetime in PA. Who they vote for president is not my concern, and governor is only slight concern.

 

Dems will never control the Senate and House in my lifetime in PA. Who they vote for president is not my concern, and governor is only slight concern.

 

 

Never say Never. Lots of things are backwards in this country and PA is no different.

[M1152 713]

 

I do think it is likely that PA will have a 10 round limit and assault weapons ban in the near-ish future. I believe that may-issue and local pre-emption are coming as well, so philly can ban carry like NYC unless you have one of their permits. 

 

I do know that if (when) Wolf is elected, no pro gun laws are going to be signed. 

Not here to argue but take a look at the Constitution of the Commonwealth of Pennsylvania and scroll down to Section 21. I *think* that may give them another layer of protection and we will  never see any legislation like here in NJ.  On a side note one in another thread one of our fellow NJGF members suggested going to Tanner’s a few months back. I believe that member has posted here but to respect his privacy just going to move on. So I pull into the parking lot for the first time and see a car with an Obama and NRA bumper sticker on it, LOL. It might be a Blue state but again I think they will be OK for a while on 2A.

[JohnnyB 4,325]

HUD is telling local zone boards that cant limit Certain types of buildings... They are actively trying to succeeding in turning the suburbs into the cities especially since the cities are losing revenue due to the flight of people.

 

All in the name of fairness.  

The major cities are like a benign tumor of crime which can be dealt with by avoiding them. HUD, by spreading the cancerous cells to neighboring communities is creating

a malignancy which can't be avoided.

 

It's really a great feeling when you work your butt off to live in a nice peaceful neighborhood and HUD places a crack dealer next door to you!

[revenger 473]

I read on the NRA-ILA site that the DC mayor signed an emergency carry law.  Qualified citizens will be able to start "applying" on Oct 22.    It will be interesting to see who exactly has "good cause" or "justifiable need" and if the courts allow their permitting scheme as they copied NJ's or Maryland's laws which has already survived the circuit courts.     Maybe this one will force SCOTUS to hear the case but by than who knows what "Chief Justice Holder" will do.

[HBecwithFn7 296]

I read on the NRA-ILA site that the DC mayor signed an emergency carry law.  Qualified citizens will be able to start "applying" on Oct 22.    It will be interesting to see who exactly has "good cause" or "justifiable need" and if the courts allow their permitting scheme as they copied NJ's or Maryland's laws which has already survived the circuit courts.     Maybe this one will force SCOTUS to hear the case but by than who knows what "Chief Justice Holder" will do.

 

It won't be "Chief Justice" Holder unless/until John G. Roberts resigns/retires/dies/is removed via impeachment & trial.

 

But, yes, it will be interesting to see what happens. I wonder though if things might be different due to the level of scrutiny/exposure (i.e. "whole 2A world is watching...").

[Newtonian 453]

PA is Republican and even if you pack another 1 million people into Philly, Bucks, and Montco, and they never vote for another Republican governor or president again, it will still be a Republican state. And it will still be the state with the strongest gun culture and highest number of carry/NRA membership in the US. There is cause for alarm from all the losers from NY and NJ moving in, no doubt. But acting like the Sword of Damocles is over us is silly. It's more likely Texas would turn Dem or pass more anti-gun laws. PA passed pro-gun laws under gun-hating Fast Eddie Rendel, they've passed them since, they are passing them now, and they will pass them in the foreseeable future. As far as anti-gun laws are concerned, for now we are really only concerned about being blindsided by the nibbling laws that are placeholders for future gun control action.

Between 1920 and 1988 Pa voted Republican in 12 presidential elections and Democrat in 7. Since 1992 it has voted Democrat six straight times.

 

This is a trend we're seeing all over. Florida a battleground state? Colorado and Nevada Democrat?

 

In 1960 Nixon campaigned in 49 states. In 2012 the battleground states numbered fewer than 20. When I lived in NH the state was solidly Republican. Now...

 

It swings back and forth somewhat. NJ has a "republican" governor and NYC elected a "republican" mayor a few cycles ago. But the trend is unmistakable. The country is becoming more liberal. Just wait until all those professional weed whackers hanging out on corners in Easton get the vote. Spread them out into the rural counties and before long you'll have a New Jersey type mess.

 

Outposts of sanity will probably endure here and there for decades. Some states will pass less restrictive gun laws. Yes it's been a very good 28 years for gun rights but this is where the fun ends. As long as the Supreme Court refuses substantive 2nd Amendment cases we are at the mercy of the voting hordes. 

 

As I've warned many times this is as good as it will ever get. Just as happened with upstate NY, when Pennsylvania politicians realize they don't need the hillbilly vote they will turn on gun rights like maggots on roadkill. A magazine ban here, an assault rifle ban there, restricting concealed carry reciprocity, the possibilities are endless. 

[remixer 1,645]

thats the point.  It does not take Masses to move to PA to make changes it just takes strategic moves.  Put a few here and a few there, Wont be long till those few become quite a large amount of government clients.  I in no way wish this on PA but i think its going to happen one state at a time, especially on the east coast..   I spend hours a day in my car and i see more and more PA lic plates coming to NY in the AM and Leaving in the PM... These are Nyers that moved to pa

[ryan_j 0]

Jealousy is the root of all evil..

Not really. Before I moved here I looked at the poconos. When I saw what it had become I did not want to move there. Besides I worked in NJ anyway, as do many people who live in Eastern PA.

 

NJ sucks overall but my part of NJ is quite nice and rural. If I could take away the bad gun laws and lower the taxes a bit I would love to stay. But as it is I see myself moving away, probably southwest. It's not just gun laws and taxes but the real and political climate. I was in Dallas the other day. I went to church on Sunday and it was packed. Packed as in ushers had to tell people to sit closer together and at one point there was standing room only. Meanwhile in NJ the church on Sunday looks empty like a weekday mass. You would think with all the catholic Italians here that Church would be full on Sunday. People seem to have more respect for God and country in other places. That is what I value the most.

[Newtonian 453]

The major cities are like a benign tumor of crime which can be dealt with by avoiding them. HUD, by spreading the cancerous cells to neighboring communities is creating

a malignancy which can't be avoided.

 

It's really a great feeling when you work your butt off to live in a nice peaceful neighborhood and HUD places a crack dealer next door to you!

The problem is not ONLY demographics, although those will eventually do us in. Maybe not everywhere within the lifetime of Mipafox (the avatar formerly known as Phosgene). However that will take 2-3 generations, 40-50 years. A more immediate threat is the brainwashing of our children, which has been going on right under our noses for the last several decades. 

 

Take one issue, gay marriage. To say it was not a mainstream issue 10 years ago is an understatement. It was but a gleam in the eyes of kooky leftists and gay activists. In 2008 Pres.-elect Ebola and Hillary Fat Legs both declared their devotion and undying dedication to traditional marriage. In just four years gay marriage became a plank in the Democratic Party platform. One buffoon after the other got up at the convention to show his/her support for "being able to love anyone (or presumably any thing) you want." 

 

You guys think I'm a kook. Want to read something REALLY kooky: 61% of Republican-leaning voters aged 18-29 support same-sex marriage as per a 2014 poll. Imagine how many democrat-leaning kids support it? We have lots of 17-29 year olds in our extended family. Every single one thinks I'm Hitler because I believe we should think more deeply about this issue, and for suggesting that it may not be a great idea.

 

I'm not chiming in here pro or anti gay marriage, just pointing out what kids think about this critical left-wing issue.

 

Closer to home, another poll showed support for gun ownership to be just 41% among those aged 18-29, 42% among married women, and a pathetic 31% among unmarried women (lots more of those than you think as marriage rates decline).

 

Think about it: These 18-29 year olds are voting today, and will be running for political office beginning now and over the next 20-30 years. Also, half the voters in the U.S., and presumably in Pennsylvania, are women. 

 

 

I would pick my timeframes for the maturation or evolution of issues like this one with great caution. Things happen a lot faster these days than when the telegraph was the only form of long-distance communication.