Shoot! 0 Posted October 20, 2014 Hello I have had a a FID card since at least 2010. I had to reapply twice since for changes to the card. I got my latest one back in August (after a 5 month wait which is absurd). Now I've come to find out the police are calling people who are not on my list of references as recently as last week to ask them "how do you feel about so and so owning a gun". Is this legit? Can they continue to probe after the fact? Are they allowed to call random people and ask them about my gun ownership? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Respect2A 0 Posted October 20, 2014 Can you be more specific? Who are they calling? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
WP22 1,558 Posted October 20, 2014 Who are these "random people"? Your neighboor? Your boss? Your mother in law? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Shoot! 0 Posted October 20, 2014 They contacted on of my extended family members. I'm not sure what level of detail is needed so if you need more info let me know. But I mean even so that person was not on my reference list and my card is in hand. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Vlad G 345 Posted October 20, 2014 I'd contact a lawyer and raise bloody hell. What town was this in? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bhunted 887 Posted October 20, 2014 +1.... For sure.... Who'd you piss off? How they know your contacts outside your application? I'd contact a lawyer and raise bloody hell. What town was this in? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Shoot! 0 Posted October 20, 2014 +1.... For sure.... Who'd you piss off? How they know your contacts outside your application? I don't see how I would have pissed anyone off. As for how they got other contacts, that's my question! It's also a delicate balance of screaming bloody murder and pissing off the town police vs shutting up. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Vlad G 345 Posted October 20, 2014 Listen, if you are afraid of pissing them off, they have already won, so you might as well turn the other cheek. Call a lawyer, and have the lawyer call the chief of police. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
RUTGERS95 889 Posted October 20, 2014 I don't see how I would have pissed anyone off. As for how they got other contacts, that's my question! It's also a delicate balance of screaming bloody murder and pissing off the town police vs shutting up. are you kidding here? you have rights, they are required to abide by rules to insure your rights are not violated. Some of you need to stop with 'I don't want to piss off my town's cops' bs. grow a fking set and go in there and demand some answers Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Shoot! 0 Posted October 20, 2014 I'll confirm the story with the person they called and see if I can look at the number they called him from. While you're saying they've won don't they win if I have to shell out cash to some attorney. Seems like a pretty lose lose situation to try it that way. Contacting the chief with the exact info might be better. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TonyS. 12 Posted October 20, 2014 I wonder if it's really a cop from where you're licensed. We've had plenty of calls from people claiming they were cops or from local PBA who we found weren't legit. I'd be calling the Chief and asking some questions pronto, Tonto. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Shoot! 0 Posted October 20, 2014 I wonder if it's really a cop from where you're licensed. We've had plenty of calls from people claiming they were cops or from local PBA who we found weren't legit. I'd be calling the Chief and asking some questions pronto, Tonto. Seems odd that anyone else would have both my info and his. But I'm going to get the info from him on what number contacted him and see if I can piece this together a bit more. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
siderman 1,134 Posted October 20, 2014 As a fellow Bergenite am curious to what town? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mipafox 438 Posted October 20, 2014 A cop can pick up the phone and call anybody he wants and ask them any question he wants just like you can. Unless he illegally accessed information, illegally released information, or has created a pattern of harassment (good luck) he can do what he wants. Not sure if any of those circumstances apply. If not, a lawyer can probably get him off your back but nothing more. I am not a lawyer of course, and noted above some questions I do not have answers to. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Vlad G 345 Posted October 20, 2014 I'll confirm the story with the person they called and see if I can look at the number they called him from. While you're saying they've won don't they win if I have to shell out cash to some attorney. Seems like a pretty lose lose situation to try it that way. Contacting the chief with the exact info might be better. How exactly do they win if you pay a lawyer? Sometimes defending your rights costs effort and money Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Shoot! 0 Posted October 20, 2014 How exactly do they win if you pay a lawyer? Sometimes defending your rights costs effort and moneyBecause I don't have unlimited resources so I have to decide what battles to fight. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Vlad G 345 Posted October 20, 2014 To my mind they only win if you back off from the fight. But, its is you decision to make. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
raz-0 1,256 Posted October 20, 2014 The only thing that would even remotely make sense is if you have a relative who is a felon and they contacted as part of the investigation to make sure they would not have access (i.e. don't live with you). But if that were the case, it should have happened before approval. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
High Exposure 5,635 Posted October 20, 2014 I'll confirm the story with the person they called and see if I can look at the number they called him from. While you're saying they've won don't they win if I have to shell out cash to some attorney. Seems like a pretty lose lose situation to try it that way. Contacting the chief with the exact info might be better.That's easy math: Freedom > Money Contact the person that handles the FID stuff first. Don't like what they say then take it to the Chief. If you get no traction there, go to the mayor. Each of these routes cost nothing more than a stamp, phone call, email, or a drive to HQ. Verify they actually called, then ask for their reason and justification. If the answers don't satisfy you, take the next step. There's time for a lawyer after the free ways don't work. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mipafox 438 Posted October 20, 2014 Because I don't have unlimited resources so I have to decide what battles to fight. Start a collection for the legal expenses here at NJGunforums. I'm sure you'll have the retainer covered in short order. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Posted October 20, 2014 the fact that you need to provide references and ask permission from LEO to own a firearm, is unconstitutional!! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PD2K 115 Posted October 20, 2014 They contacted on of my extended family members. I'm not sure what level of detail is needed so if you need more info let me know. But I mean even so that person was not on my reference list and my card is in hand. Sounds fishy to me. I could be wrong, but I don't think the Police would go though the trouble of searching for and contacting anyone not on your list. My course of action would be: 1. Contact your family member and get as much details as possible (name, date, time, caller ID, etc). 2. Contact the Chief and Mayor. Inform them of this (both in person and via certified mail). Let them know that you suspect that this is fraudulent, as the police would NEVER contact anyone not on your list after your received your FID. If possible, file a formal police report of fraud. Now if the police admit they did indeed contact your [non-listed] relative, then I would contact ANJRPC and NJ2AS: http://www.anjrpc.org/?page=A_Strikeforce http://www.nj2as.com/ Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Scrap 4 Posted October 20, 2014 This sounds to me a lot different than a FID concern, as in they're calling to check about issuing your (already long-since issued) FID. This sounds like somebody complained about you or someone made some sort of thinly veiled or outright inflammatory 'warning' like 'Joe Blow is disgruntled at work and mumbling about retribution' or even something ridiculous as, you and Suzy Cue got into it regarding a local parking spot or who had to pay the tab for your disastrous dating times, and now she's making sure you remember her etc. OR As stated it's a bogus non-cop. I could go on and on about the things it could be, bottom line, it doesn't sound right nor proper and if it was me I sure as sugar would want to know the genesis of these calls and who needs what information from whom about me and my firearms. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Pizza Bob 1,488 Posted October 20, 2014 I'd contact a lawyer and raise bloody hell. This^^^^^^^^^^ NJAC 13:54-1.15: Any background investigation conducted by the chief of police, the Superintendent or the county prosecutor, of any applicant for a permit, firearms identification card license, or registration, in accordance with the requirements of this chapter, is not a public record and shall not be disclosed to any person not authorized by law or this chapter to have access to such investigation, including the applicant. Any application for a permit, firearms identification card, or license, and any document reflecting the issuance or denial of such permit, firearms identification card, or license, and any permit, firearms identification card, license, certification, certificate, form of register, or registration statement, maintained by any State or municipal governmental agency, is not a public record and shall not be disclosed to any person not authorized by law or this chapter to have access to such documentation, including the applicant, except on the request of persons acting in their governmental capacities for purposes of the administration of justice. Just sayin' Adios, Pizza Bob Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Newtonian 453 Posted October 20, 2014 All they have to do is find one person who disapproves and you don't get your permits. I hope they don't ask my mother... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mipafox 438 Posted October 20, 2014 This^^^^^^^^^^ NJAC 13:54-1.15: Any background investigation conducted by the chief of police, the Superintendent or the county prosecutor, of any applicant for a permit, firearms identification card license, or registration, in accordance with the requirements of this chapter, is not a public record and shall not be disclosed to any person not authorized by law or this chapter to have access to such investigation, including the applicant. Any application for a permit, firearms identification card, or license, and any document reflecting the issuance or denial of such permit, firearms identification card, or license, and any permit, firearms identification card, license, certification, certificate, form of register, or registration statement, maintained by any State or municipal governmental agency, is not a public record and shall not be disclosed to any person not authorized by law or this chapter to have access to such documentation, including the applicant, except on the request of persons acting in their governmental capacities for purposes of the administration of justice. Just sayin' Adios, Pizza Bob I think you should take that and put it in the same letter about his 4 month delay to renew his FID! I'm sure NJs Super Troopers will get right on that. And the legislators! More than half of this forum are cops, I'm sure they will fix it. They are sworn officers of the court and can call that police department to find out what is up. BTW - the OP never actually said the police stated this had anything to do with an FID application. What if a cop requests a records pull of an FID or pistol purchase record during a traffic stop and asks where my gun is? Is he in violation because he let the occupants of my vehicle know I own a gun? Information is abused the moment it is compulsory registered. No law will ever protect you from the government misusing your information. Even if there was the remote chance of such a silly thing happening, they can change the law anytime they like and then abuse your information at will. Retroactively. That's the reason they collect it. I appreciate you guys at least considering sticking up for yourselves, but from the outside looking in, it looks like inmates taking a stand because they ordered red leg irons and received pink ones. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DeerSlayer 241 Posted October 20, 2014 Didn't I just read this exact thread on NJHuntingforum? Or is my mind starting to slip? Deja vu Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kc17 622 Posted October 21, 2014 A cop can pick up the phone and call anybody he wants and ask them any question he wants just like you can. Unless he illegally accessed information, illegally released information, or has created a pattern of harassment (good luck) he can do what he wants. Not sure if any of those circumstances apply. If not, a lawyer can probably get him off your back but nothing more. I am not a lawyer of course, and noted above some questions I do not have answers to. I'm far from being a lawyer as well, but if a LEO calls someone and identifies themselves as LEO, I'd suspect that's much different than Joe Schmoe making that call. And I would think if that LEO is making such inquiries without justification, that's an issue. As for the matter at hand, if I found myself in this position, I'd contact the person calling and politely inquire why. If not satisfied with the response, then go up the chain and/or contact a lawyer and/or the NRA. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites