NJ Gun laws work as intended

[millsan1 3]

Given that the intent is to discourage people from owning guns, or in this case, a pellet gun.

 

A friend at work is having a rodent problem with his chicken coup.  Traps, etc are not working.

 

He said "I am going to get an air rifle, stake out the coup, and shoot whatever is coming in."

 

When I explained to him he needed to get an NJFID to buy an air rifle, he was surprised.  He said that he would go to PA and just buy one.  He was even more surprised when I told him if he did so, and brought it back to NJ, he would be a felon.

 

He then asked how long it takes to get an FID.  "A couple of days?", he guessed.  LOL.  Told him the truth.

 

So after all of this, he has decided not to go through the trouble of getting an FID and will forgo getting a pellet gun.

 

Congrats, NJ, you protected some rats and trampled on another man.

[Mr.Stu 1,922]

What part of buying it in PA and bringing it back to NJ would make him a felon?

 

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[PK90 3,570]

The blind leading the blind.

[GRIZ 3,369]

What part of buying it in PA and bringing it back to NJ would make him a felon?Sent from my SCH-I800 using Tapatalk 2

Same here.

[millsan1 3]

Rifles or Shotguns – Any person who knowingly has in her possession any rifle or shotgun without first having obtained a firearms purchaser identification card is guilty of a crime of the third degree. The purchaser identification card also must be obtained to acquire a rifle or shotgun. The same card is used for both the acquisition and possession.

[millsan1 3]

(3) In the case of a crime of the third degree, for a specific term of years which shall be fixed by the court and shall be between three years and five years;

[Mr.Stu 1,922]

Transporting store to home - exempt

Transporting range to home - exempt

Transporting between home and premises owned - exempt

Possession at home and premises owned - exempt

 

What am I missing?

 

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[millsan1 3]

post #5?

 

Also, if you buy a firearm out of state, it must go through an FFL, either in that state or your home state.  Now, a BB gun is not a firearm anywhere else, so I doubt you could get an FFL in PA to run a PICS on the purchase, so in theory, it would have to be shipped to NJ and fun through an NJ FFL.  No NJ FID = No go.

All those transporting exemptions are in place with an NJ FID or with legally owned firearms (read inherited).  No NJ FID, no exemptions.

[millsan1 3]

And to end my responses here, anyone who is feeling froggy, and is sure of the legality, please go to PA, buy a pellet gun, come back to NJ and give it to a neighbor or relative without an FID and then call the cops and tell them what you just did.  I will send you $ for your commissary in the joint.

[Mr.Stu 1,922]

"No FID, no exemptions"

 

Wrong, wrong and...oh yeah utterly wrong.

 

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[Mr.Stu 1,922]

A pellet gun is not a firearm in PA so you can transfer it there to your heart's content and break no laws. Do it in NJ without a FPID and CoE you're in trouble. I can get a pellet gun in PA and take it home. My neighbor who does not have a FPID can go to PA and get a pellet gun and take it to his home.

 

I can't transfer it to him in NJ.

 

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[jackandjill 683]

I may take on the challenge for mere $1000  (but will NOT give the pellet thingy to someone else) :-) . 

 

I know this is covered a million times before... but

 

-------------------------------------------------

2C:39-6  Exemptions.
 f.Nothing in subsections b., c. and d. of N.J.S.2C:39-5 shall be construed to prevent:

 

 

2C:39-6 b, c, d being what you quoted partly. ....

[PK90 3,570]

New Jersey laws do not apply in other states.

[millsan1 3]

I am totally willing to admit when I am wrong, but I have not seen that here yet.  Let's recap:

 

 

Buy a pellet gun in PA.  Completely legal.

Posses a Pellet gun in NJ.  Must have an FID, unless I am reading this incorrectly, and please show me where I am.

Transport a firearm from another state to NJ (again, we are talking about NJ law, where a pellet gun is a firearm) - Illegal without going through an FFL in one state or the other. 

 

So if I am wrong, please show me how.  Telling me I am wrong is great, but not convincing without citation.

[CMJeepster 2,778]

Posses a Pellet gun in NJ.  Must have an FID, unless I am reading this incorrectly, and please show me where I am.

Transport a firearm from another state to NJ (again, we are talking about NJ law, where a pellet gun is a firearm) - Illegal without going through an FFL in one state or the other. 

You're getting terminology mixed up here.

 

One can purchase & transport an air rifle (no pistols) from PA to NJ without going through a FFL.  One must complete the NJSP C.O.E. form (http://www.njsp.org/info/pdf/firearms/sp-634.pdf) at the place of purchase.

 

Q3  "A3: It is the responsibility of the seller of the shotguns, including bb, pellet, firearm to ascertain that the buyer has a and black powder rifles? Firearms Purchaser Identification Card plus one additional form of photo identification and a completes Certificate of Eligibility. The information contained on the Firearms Purchaser Identification Card must match the identification of the transferor. A Certificate of Eligibility can be obtained at any licensed firearms dealer, or this web site."    http://www.njsp.org/about/firearms-faqs.html

[millsan1 3]

This post shows that you must have an FID to purchase a pellet gun, no?

 

You're getting terminology mixed up here.

 

One can purchase & transport an air rifle (no pistols) from PA to NJ without going through a FFL.  One must complete the NJSP C.O.E. form (http://www.njsp.org/info/pdf/firearms/sp-634.pdf) at the place of purchase.

 

Q3  "A3: It is the responsibility of the seller of the shotguns, including bb, pellet, firearm to ascertain that the buyer has a and black powder rifles? Firearms Purchaser Identification Card plus one additional form of photo identification and a completes Certificate of Eligibility. The information contained on the Firearms Purchaser Identification Card must match the identification of the transferor. A Certificate of Eligibility can be obtained at any licensed firearms dealer, or this web site."    http://www.njsp.org/about/firearms-faqs.html

 

This post shows that one must posses an FID to purchase a pellet gun, no?

[Mr.Stu 1,922]

You are reading it incorrectly. The exemptions override the clause about the FPID card. You do not need an FPID card to possess under the exemptions. I can't quote the statutes as I'm on my tablet and cut and paste is a nightmare. - look at the stickies in the law section of this forum.

 

You are also confused about the difference between transporting across state lines and selling to non state residents. I can take my lawfully owned guns to and from PA without going through an FFL. If I want to take possession of a long gun in another state I must use an FFL. If I want to take possession of a handgun it must go through an FFL in my home state.

 

How do you think I manage to legally attend pistol matches in PA on a Sunday and get home the same day when NJ-NICS is closed on Sundays?

 

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[1LtCAP 4,263]

Given that the intent is to discourage people from owning guns, or in this case, a pellet gun.

 

A friend at work is having a rodent problem with his chicken coup.  Traps, etc are not working.

 

He said "I am going to get an air rifle, stake out the coup, and shoot whatever is coming in."

 

When I explained to him he needed to get an NJFID to buy an air rifle, he was surprised.  He said that he would go to PA and just buy one.  He was even more surprised when I told him if he did so, and brought it back to NJ, he would be a felon.

 

He then asked how long it takes to get an FID.  "A couple of days?", he guessed.  LOL.  Told him the truth.

 

So after all of this, he has decided not to go through the trouble of getting an FID and will forgo getting a pellet gun.

 

Congrats, NJ, you protected some rats and trampled on another man.

I BELIEVE this part to be wrong.

[CMJeepster 2,778]

This post shows that one must posses an FID to purchase a pellet gun, no?

 

It's law in NJ, but chances are you will not be asked for it in PA.  Hell, when I bought my pellet gun in PA, I had to beg the "kid" behind the counter to fill out a CoE for it since he didn't even ask for any form of I.D.  I told him that I was from NJ and didn't want to take any chances.  He had to call 3 different people to find the form in the store.

[CMJeepster 2,778]

I can't quote the statutes as I'm on my tablet and cut and paste is a nightmare. - look at the stickies in the law section of this forum.

 

http://www.njsp.org/info/pdf/firearms/062408_title13ch54.pdf

[Malsua 1,422]

This post shows that you must have an FID to purchase a pellet gun, no?

 

 

This post shows that one must posses an FID to purchase a pellet gun, no?

 

There is no requirement to have an FPID to own a firearm.   If a firearm is purchased legally in a different state, and is legal in NJ(i.e. not AWB), then it's legal to have and to hold in NJ, FPID or no FPID.

 

A pellet gun can be purchased legally in a different state.   Bring it home and shoot it to your hearts content...having an FPID is immaterial to the situation unless you intend to use the pellet gun outside of the exemptions.

[millsan1 3]

You are reading it incorrectly. The exemptions override the clause about the FPID card. You do not need an FPID card to possess under the exemptions. I can't quote the statutes as I'm on my tablet and cut and paste is a nightmare. - look at the stickies in the law section of this forum.

 

You are also confused about the difference between transporting across state lines and selling to non state residents. I can take my lawfully owned guns to and from PA without going through an FFL. If I want to take possession of a long gun in another state I must use an FFL. If I want to take possession of a handgun it must go through an FFL in my home state.

 

How do you think I manage to legally attend pistol matches in PA on a Sunday and get home the same day when NJ-NICS is closed on Sundays?

 

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I bolded the area that I believe causes this to be illegal.

 

While the pellet rifle and purchase is legal in PA, it would not be legal in NJ and hence teh transportation would notbe exempt.  The person does not have an NJ FID.  Therefore owning the pellet gun in NJ is illegal.

 

I knwo I can transport my legally owned firearms across state lines, that is not what I was talkign about.  I was talking about buying a gun (by NJ definitions) in PA and bringing it back to NJ (with no FID).

[millsan1 3]

There is no requirement to have an FPID to own a firearm.   If a firearm is purchased legally in a different state, and is legal in NJ(i.e. not AWB), then it's legal to have and to hold in NJ, FPID or no FPID.

 

A pellet gun can be purchased legally in a different state.   Bring it home and shoot it to your hearts content...having an FPID is immaterial to the situation unless you intend to use the pellet gun outside of the exemptions.

 

 

From CM Jeepster above:

 

Q3  "A3: It is the responsibility of the seller of the shotguns, including bb, pellet, firearm to ascertain that the buyer has a and black powder rifles? Firearms Purchaser Identification Card

[Mr.Stu 1,922]

From CM Jeepster above:

 

Q3 "A3: It is the responsibility of the seller of the shotguns, including bb, pellet, firearm to ascertain that the buyer has a and black powder rifles? Firearms Purchaser Identification Card

This is an NJ law and does not have any weight in PA.

 

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[CMJeepster 2,778]

We're splitting hairs now, folks.  If the pellet rifle is leagally acquired in PA according to PA's laws and it's legal to possess in NJ according to NJ's laws, then I am of the opinion that you're good to go.

 

http://www.njsp.org/about/firearms-faqs.html

 

A10: Firearms which have been legally acquired in another state and are legal to possess in New Jersey may be brought to New Jersey by the owner when residency is established. The owner may VOLUNTARILY register the firearm(s) by completing a Voluntary Form of Firearms Registration, however the owner is not obligated to do so.

[CMJeepster 2,778]

This is an NJ law and does not have any weight in PA.

 

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I fully understand that.  I chose to take the extra (not required by PA law) of having a CoE filled out for my purchase.  I was not asked for, nor did I present my FPID for the purchase, so therefore I didn't follow NJ law because I was purchasing in PA.  I did the CoE in the off chance that it would ever become an issue when I returned to my home in NJ.  (For example if a neighbor saw me with my pellet rifle in my yard and had the police investigate.  I can claim that the proper form was filled out by the seller.)

[Malsua 1,422]

From CM Jeepster above:

 

Q3  "A3: It is the responsibility of the seller of the shotguns, including bb, pellet, firearm to ascertain that the buyer has a and black powder rifles? Firearms Purchaser Identification Card

 

So what?  NJ laws don't apply in PA.  NJ doesn't have some sort of invisible hand that controls you outside of NJ.   The feds do, but only as they apply to firearms...pellet guns are not firearms federally.

 

Furthermore, if you are traveling to your home with firearms, you are within the exemptions, so that's not an issue either.

[Kingsoverqueens 10]

We're splitting hairs now, folks.  If the pellet rifle is leagally acquired in PA according to PA's laws and it's legal to possess in NJ according to NJ's laws, then I am of the opinion that you're good to go.

 

http://www.njsp.org/about/firearms-faqs.html

 

A10: Firearms which have been legally acquired in another state and are legal to possess in New Jersey may be brought to New Jersey by the owner when residency is established. The owner may VOLUNTARILY register the firearm(s) by completing a Voluntary Form of Firearms Registration, however the owner is not obligated to do so.

He's already a NJ resident and therefor required to hold a NJFID in order to purchase guns, no?

 

A10 speaks to people who have owned guns while a resident of another state and moved to NJ, not for people who go out of state and buy guns.

[Sandy 44]

It seems you may have given your friend wrong information about acquiring a BB rifle in PA. It happens , the laws are confusing , even to the people who are supposed to be enforcing them.

However , there is a salient point not being addressed. Regardless of whether or not he can legally require it out of NJ , he has to bring it back to NJ where it is in fact considered a rifle. Hence , he has to abide by firearm discharge laws in his town . He can get it here legally , most people on this thread are sure of it. His bigger problem is finding out if he is allowed to kill pests with it on his property in NJ. I recall a guy in NJ who got into decent trouble for shooting a squirrel on his property with his BB gun in NJ.

Buy the BB gun in PA , shoot cans in the basement , get an outdoor cat. Problem solved.

[CMJeepster 2,778]

He's already a NJ resident and therefor required to hold a NJFID in order to purchase guns, no?

 

A10 speaks to people who have owned guns while a resident of another state and moved to NJ, not for people who go out of state and buy guns.

 

Purchase in NJ because chances are you're not going to get carded anywhere else.

 

I interpereted out-of-state residency as a temporary situation, like being on vacation, because as stated above, NJ can't reach out to PA to enforce B.S. laws.