Evil featured AR Barrel

[fslater 62]

I'm doing an (my first) AR build. Can I buy a threaded barrel delivered to my home, install the gas block and then take the barrel and comp to a gunsmith to be screwed on, pinned and welded? Or do I have to have it shipped directly to the gunsmith and have it pinned and welded before I take possession? This is for a barrel only, not attached to a lower.

[effd27145 0]

The general consensus is your good to go as long as you don't fall within the idea of "constructive possession" of an illegal firearm. Pretty much just make sure you don't have all the parts in your house at the same time to complete building your AR if one of them would be considered an illegal "evil" feature.

[mikka1 2]

The general consensus is your good to go as long as you don't fall within the idea of "constructive possession" of an illegal firearm. Pretty much just make sure you don't have all the parts in your house at the same time to complete building your AR if one of them would be considered an illegal "evil" feature.

 

This is a kind of a comment I've never been able to comprehend.

If I order a non-compliant assembled upper and I already have at least one AR at home, it almost always means I can just press 2 pins in my existing AR, remove the "old" upper assembly and install a new non-compliant one. All in less than 20 seconds. And, voila, I am in a possession of an evil assault rifle and an instant felon.

I'll tell even more - let's say you have a pump-action shotgun with an aftermarket adjustable AR-style stock and a compliant AR with a pinned stock (both of which seem to be perfectly legal). Following such a logic, you still should be charged with a possession of a non-compliant firearm as you might technically remove the adjustable stock from your shotty and put in onto your AR...

 

This "constructive possession" or "constructive intent" is probably the most f****g stupid thing I've ever heard about any regulations/legislation in my life. Every time I hear about it, I remember an old soviet-era joke about moonshining (which was prohibited even for personal consumption), when an official enters a guy's house and finds a moonshine still.

"Okay, - he says, - now we are gonna charge you with a moonshining!" - "But sir, I haven't been making moonshine!!!" - "That doesn't matter, you have all the necessary equipment" - "Okay, okay, but then charge me with a rape as well..." - "Why? Have you raped someone?" - "No, but I have all the necessary equipment".

[effd27145 0]

I am not in any way saying I agree with that statement, as dumb as it is, look at the state that we all live in. Tell me you don't think there is a prosecutor out there that would try to make that argument in court and I will happily recant that, but from what I have seen on this forum the past few years the consensus is if you wanna play it extremely safe, this has the least chance of getting you nailed to the wall as an example.

 

I'm not saying that's particularly what I would follow if building another ar, but for a guy trying to play it safe with his first build and asking for legal advice on this forum, that is my response.

 

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[checko 180]

The only part that is stand alone firearm is the serialized lower. Everything else is hunks of plastic and metal.

 

I don't know that there is case law for constructive intent but I sure as hell wouldn't want to get caught with a disassembled "assault weapon". Though the chances of the fuzz busting down the door is very close to 0

[Melgamatic 66]

Every time I hear about it, I remember an old soviet-era joke about moonshining (which was prohibited even for personal consumption), when an official enters a guy's house and finds a moonshine still.

"Okay, - he says, - now we are gonna charge you with a moonshining!" - "But sir, I haven't been making moonshine!!!" - "That doesn't matter, you have all the necessary equipment" - "Okay, okay, but then charge me with a rape as well..." - "Why? Have you raped someone?" - "No, but I have all the necessary equipment".

 

There are many people in prison who had all the materials in their home to cook meth.  They were not cooking, they were not using, but they had purchased all the means necessary, and that's all they need.

 

In fact, crossing a state line with more than $10K of cash will land you in jail for a short time, and get all your cash seized permanently, because it seems like something someone somehow involved in drugs might do for some reason.

 

I think you are OK with your non-compliant barrel in your home as long as you want.  However, if something else goes wrong in your life (like maybe two criminals break in when you aren't home and kill each other), when the cops search and find it they are going to try to jam you up.  It's all a matter of risk management.

[fslater 62]

OK .... Sorry guys but amidst all the that's stupid bull shit commentary that usually gets thread topics side tracked, if possible I'd still like an answer to my question. As a matter of fact, let me rephrase it to a simplified version. Its my understanding that if one brings a non compliant firearm to an FFL or gunsmith for whatever reason, they are obligated by law to report it to the NJSP. If I take in a pre-threaded barrel (with gas block installed) by itself along with the comp (off the barrel) to be screwed on, pinned and welded, does this fall into the category of having to be reported to the NJSP? 

[PK90 3,570]

[glockncolts 50]

Its not a firearm, its just parts. You are fine,,,,

[MedicYeti 96]

I Am Not A Lawyer. Yes; you can get the barrel delivered to your home and do the work on it at home. I have the barrel delivered, put on the barrel nut, gas block then I attach the muzzle device. I like to have the device permanently attached before mounting the barrel to the upper, I my opinion it's not "readily assembled" if I need to vise block and use tools to put it together.

[mikka1 2]

OK .... Sorry guys but amidst all the that's stupid bull shit commentary that usually gets thread topics side tracked, if possible I'd still like an answer to my question. As a matter of fact, let me rephrase it to a simplified version. Its my understanding that if one brings a non compliant firearm to an FFL or gunsmith for whatever reason, they are obligated by law to report it to the NJSP. If I take in a pre-threaded barrel (with gas block installed) by itself along with the comp (off the barrel) to be screwed on, pinned and welded, does this fall into the category of having to be reported to the NJSP? 

 

fslater, my real point was that you shouldn't even try to look for proper legal-related advice here (PK90's reply is really the best one )

I very much respect all the guys here, but when you ask pretty much anything about the law, everyone will just tell you "No", "Don't do this", "Be on a safe side", "There are people issue tickets for speeding when they were driving out of Costco lot with new "performance" tires in their trunk" with lots of disclaimers like "IANAL and I don't pretend to be" etc. etc.

I stupidly ran into the same issue many times asking about certain transportation laws etc. Just understand the fact, that you will NOT get an answer you're looking for here. Period. Talk to people at ranges. Talk to your FFL. Talk to people at USPSA/IDPA matches. Talk to as much people as you can and then make YOUR own conclusions (as likely you'll hear different things).

 

Sorry if that hurts someone's feelings, I didn't mean to address it to anyone personally

[checko 180]

 

If I take in a pre -threaded barrel (with gas block installed) by itself along with the comp (off the barrel) to be screwed on, pinned and welded, does this fall into the category of having to be reported to the NJSP?

 

The only part that is stand alone firearm is the serialized lower. Everything else is hunks of plastic and metal.

Can one be reported for a threaded spoon or threaded light bulb base?

 

 

It is just a piece of metal until it is on a serialized gun. So, no, you won't be reported for having a a top welded on to your metal stick.

[fslater 62]

Thanks everyone..... I personally think (without going back and reading thru the statute) that if your found to have all the parts in the same place to build the rifle especially the serialized lower your violating the law here in Jersey. Some BS about parts to make, is in there some where if I remember correctly? But Probably mikka1 is right ..... Don't look for or accept advice here as being legally correct. Guess the best thing to do is just choose and talk to a gunsmith before I order  and if he says sure, no problem just bring it in I'll go that way. If he says a threaded  barrel with an unpinned comp has to be reported to the NJ Nazi's (no disrespect to the LEO's just the system)  I'll just have it shipped to him c/o me and pay the extra $ to have him do the gas block too.

 

On a side bar: I'll never get used to reading the ridiculous hoops we have to jump thu here on the current gun law section of the form just to stay within the limits of all the petty, meaningless crap the state comes up with thinking they're accomplishing something socially beneficial. We discuss the laws with the hopes of trying to change and stay within them........ I'm wondering how many gang bangers and drug dealers to whom the laws are aimed at care what it says or would do a damned thing any different than what they please reguardless?....... "Food for thought Trenton"

[checko 180]

Be careful what ffl you talk to. They can be less informed than this forum.

 

Seen in another post that said an ffl told the person an am slant brake is illegal because its a flash hider....

[raz-0 1,259]

If you are going to bug an ffl, make sure it is an 07 known to do compliance work.

 

Some are stupid enough to do you more harm than good.

 

Constructive intent doesn't have a great record of success in courts, but it can win you a tour of the legal system that is far from free.

 

The only thing involving firearms in nj not fraught with legal peril is not owning them.

[vladtepes 1,060]

here is the real answer.. in detail.. if you have an assault weapon.. or the parts to make an assault weapon.. you are breaking the law and could be punished.. IF it will happen to you is not the question you asked.. sometimes I shake my head when advice is given on probability.. you asked if it is illegal.. and if you have an AR15.. or the parts to make an AR15.. AND have a threaded barrel for an AR15.. JUST the barrel.. by definition you are a criminal.. that is the actual answer to your question..
 

 

POSSESSION OF AN ASSAULT FIREARM

(N.J.S.A. 2C:39-5f)

POSSESSION OF AN ASSAULT FIREARM

(N.J.S.A. 2C:39-5f)

 

An assault firearm also means a part or combination of parts designed or intended to convert a firearm into an assault firearm, or any combination of parts from which an assault firearm may be readily assembled if those parts are in the possession or under the control of the same person.

 

[1LtCAP 4,263]

If you are going to bug an ffl, make sure it is an 07 known to do compliance work.

 

Some are stupid enough to do you more harm than good.

 

Constructive intent doesn't have a great record of success in courts, but it can win you a tour of the legal system that is far from free.

 

The only thing involving firearms in nj not fraught with legal peril is not owning them.

the highlighted part. what needs to happen, is that when people DO get jammed up for something stupid(like constructive intent), they need to seek reimbursement of their legal fees during their defense. i would imagine a decent lawyer should be able to recover their clients fees during the proceedings. it'd only take a couple times of this happening before they stop trying to stick that shit on us.

[1LtCAP 4,263]

here is the real answer.. in detail.. if you have an assault weapon.. or the parts to make an assault weapon.. you are breaking the law and could be punished.. IF it will happen to you is not the question you asked.. sometimes I shake my head when advice is given on probability.. you asked if it is illegal.. and if you have an AR15.. or the parts to make an AR15.. AND have a threaded barrel for an AR15.. JUST the barrel.. by definition you are a criminal.. that is the actual answer to your question..

 

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this guy is one i've leaned to pay attention to when topics such as these come up.

[vjf915 456]

fslater, my real point was that you shouldn't even try to look for proper legal-related advice here (PK90's reply is really the best one )

I very much respect all the guys here, but when you ask pretty much anything about the law, everyone will just tell you "No", "Don't do this", "Be on a safe side", "There are people issue tickets for speeding when they were driving out of Costco lot with new "performance" tires in their trunk" with lots of disclaimers like "IANAL and I don't pretend to be" etc. etc.

I stupidly ran into the same issue many times asking about certain transportation laws etc. Just understand the fact, that you will NOT get an answer you're looking for here. Period. Talk to people at ranges. Talk to your FFL. Talk to people at USPSA/IDPA matches. Talk to as much people as you can and then make YOUR own conclusions (as likely you'll hear different things).

 

Sorry if that hurts someone's feelings, I didn't mean to address it to anyone personally

I'm not sure where you're getting this from, however I've consistently seen MUCH more accurate information here for your generic "is this legal" question than I see at your average FFL.  It's not uncommon to walk into regular gun shops and hear people talking about "Greater than 10 round 'clips' being illegal".  Most of the reputable FFL's that you'll find in this state are also most likely a vendor on this site.  Information that's posted on this site is consistently correct, and when misinformation is posted it is normally contested rather quickly.  I can't read Paul's mind, however I think the facepalm he used was directed towards the OP being unnecessarily afraid of bringing just a threaded barrel into an FFL.

[vladtepes 1,060]

fslater, my real point was that you shouldn't even try to look for proper legal-related advice here (PK90's reply is really the best one )

I very much respect all the guys here, but when you ask pretty much anything about the law, everyone will just tell you "No", "Don't do this", "Be on a safe side", "There are people issue tickets for speeding when they were driving out of Costco lot with new "performance" tires in their trunk" with lots of disclaimers like "IANAL and I don't pretend to be" etc. etc.

I stupidly ran into the same issue many times asking about certain transportation laws etc. Just understand the fact, that you will NOT get an answer you're looking for here. Period. Talk to people at ranges. Talk to your FFL. Talk to people at USPSA/IDPA matches. Talk to as much people as you can and then make YOUR own conclusions (as likely you'll hear different things).

 

Sorry if that hurts someone's feelings, I didn't mean to address it to anyone personally

 

 

I am not sure what you are talking about.. when I answer legal questions on this site I generally include the actual LAW that applies.. not my opinion.. not a guess (unless stated).. in most instances I am posting the LITERAL law.. and this is absolutely NOT what you will get at MOST ranges.. and MOST gun shops..

[dman2112 6]

Only lawyers should answer legal questions

[bhunted 887]

OoooOOOOOO - Look! A Butterfly!  

[vjf915 456]

Only lawyers should answer legal questions

Well in that case, don't ask someone a legal question unless they're a lawyer.  If the entire site told people to go ask a lawyer every time someone posted a legal question, then this site would be dead.

[checko 180]

Ask a question on the internet and you get what you paid for. You can be led in the right direction but the onus is on YOU to know the law.

[carl_g 568]

All vlad told the guy was the law.. not if they should abide by it or not. The facts are stated and left up to the OP whether or not they choose to abide by the law or take a risk. The risk is small but if for some crazy situation you end up getting you caught..the consiquences could be huge.

[Carcano 14]

All vlad told the guy was the law.. not if they should abide by it or not. The facts are stated and left up to the OP whether or not they choose to abide by the law or take a risk. The risk is small but if for some crazy situation you end up getting you caught..the consiquences could be huge.

 

99% chance the OP will be fine but that 1% chance of being caught is still a very real risk. Having a non-compliant upper or parts laying around looks bad.

 

Technically it should be compliant beforehand if you are trying to stay 100% legal with no risks attached, of course you could ship it to https://www.adcofirearms.com/ and have them pin it for you.

[bhunted 887]

OoooOOOOOO - Look! Another Butterfly!

 

 

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[Carcano 14]

OoooOOOOOO - Look! Another Butterfly!

 

 

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OoooOOOOOO - Look! A smiley mall-ninja!

[bhunted 887]

OoooOOOOOO - Look! A smiley mall-ninja!

I hope you ain't calling me a mall ninja dude.

 

 

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[Carcano 14]

I hope you ain't calling me a mall ninja dude.

 

 

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No, and those HK's are not mall-ninja at all