Call to Action - Make all NJ Firearms Ownership and Carry Licenses Public Records

[mipafox 438]

I think it could do a lot of good politically to make all NJ Firearms registration and licensing records public. I fell it will bring a lot of critical attention to the state, and once and for all clear up the secret CCW records of the elite.

 

This is VERY popular among leftist politicians, especially in NY which give it pull in NJ. I already know how I plan to push this plan, and it will be largely through NJ media. But I want some input on how you think we can make the push as effective as possible, and also ensure that we end up with the actual goal satisfied - full disclosure of firearm ownership and carry rights in NJ. Anything less (such as just disclosing FIDs and names/addresses) will not give us much leverage to get help on reducing gun control in New Jersey.

[n4p226r 105]

you really need to get a life.

[maintenanceguy 510]

I'm sure the carry list is a who's who of NJ political and judge's families.  I'd love to have that list to exploit it.

[10X 3,296]

Oh hell no. Just because it's wrong that such a privileged few enjoy CCW permits doesn't mean that their privacy rights should be thrown under the bus. And I can't fathom why publicizing the records would make a bit of difference. If non gun owners read a list of a few hundred names of the rich or powerful or retired cops, their only thought will be "seems about right".

[67gtonut 847]

[AlexTheSane 236]

[mipafox 438]

I'm sure the carry list is a who's who of NJ political and judge's families.  I'd love to have that list to exploit it.

Well, I already got started, but it seems nobody works after 1700 which I am used to

 

I agree, maintenanceguy. However, I doubt I'll get support from Sweeny by asking him to disclose his address and purported permit to carry a handgun, along with a lot of other big hitters. That is the most important part of the goal, but I am keeping it quiet for now and just promoting release of FID and gun registration data. No doubt they will want police and judges/legislature exempt from the requirement :rollseyes: Already thought of that. I plan to ease it it if we can generate attention and support for the basics, and I have a plan to do that. If it looks like we are making progress we'll start discussing it privately and see if anybody can improve upon it.

[Michael2013 56]

I think it could do a lot of good politically to make all NJ Firearms registration and licensing records public. I fell it will bring a lot of critical attention to the state, and once and for all clear up the secret CCW records of the elite. This is VERY popular among leftist politicians, especially in NY which give it pull in NJ. I already know how I plan to push this plan, and it will be largely through NJ media. But I want some input on how you think we can make the push as effective as possible, and also ensure that we end up with the actual goal satisfied - full disclosure of firearm ownership and carry rights in NJ. Anything less (such as just disclosing FIDs and names/addresses) will not give us much leverage to get help on reducing gun control in New Jersey.

Many of your posts are reasonable. This one - not so much

[n4p226r 105]

Many of your posts are reasonable. This one - not so much

That's because he isn't being serious. He is trying to stir the pot because of the glock thread. Not that I agree with your first sentence though.

[mipafox 438]

That's because he isn't being serious.

I'm not sure what you mean by that, but I am quite serious in this effort. And I sure as hell don;t see how it could hurt gun rights in NJ, only help.

[ChrisJM981 924]

I'm not sure what you mean by that, but I am quite serious in this effort. And I sure as hell don;t see how it could hurt gun rights in NJ, only help.

If all the judges, politicians, and police were to be exempt from ccw numbers, there would be very few left. Not to mention that the approval percentage would drop drastically. Either way if you obtained the information, it would be fruitful.

 

With that said, didn't the NJ legislature pass a bill to prevent names and addresses from being public information after that newspaper published that map of gun permits in NY?

[mipafox 438]

If all the judges, politicians, and police were to be exempt from ccw numbers, there would be very few left.

That's not the goal, we just need to understand it may come up.

[W2MC 1,699]

I think it could do a lot of good politically to make all NJ Firearms registration and licensing records public. I fell it will bring a lot of critical attention to the state, and once and for all clear up the secret CCW records of the elite. This is VERY popular among leftist politicians, especially in NY which give it pull in NJ. I already know how I plan to push this plan, and it will be largely through NJ media. But I want some input on how you think we can make the push as effective as possible, and also ensure that we end up with the actual goal satisfied - full disclosure of firearm ownership and carry rights in NJ. Anything less (such as just disclosing FIDs and names/addresses) will not give us much leverage to get help on reducing gun control in New Jersey.

So when are you moving back to NJ.....?

[Michael2013 56]

So when are you moving back to NJ.....?

Yeah, I thought that too.

What does make sense, I think, is to make public the overall number of CCW in NJ, grouped by

- Current government employees

- Retired government employees

- All others

No names, no addresses.

Would be also interesting to compare with America.

[wayne10mm 1]

Are you crazy? This let's the criminals get acess to info on who owns guns BAD IDEA!!

[Polak 3]

You realize that's what a newspaper in NYS did and peoples houses were robbed????

 

Don't be an a**hole just because there are people who can legally carry but you can't (most likely without even trying to apply).

[Polak 3]

"If I can't have it, no one should" mentality.

[AlDente67 563]

Who got robbed?  Were they addresses where no guns were associated, or houses with guns where they came for the guns (mainly)?

 

Just curious.

[maintenanceguy 510]

..didn't the NJ legislature pass a bill to prevent names and addresses from being public information after that newspaper published that map of gun permits in NY?

 

Yes, but it wasn't to protect us from having our private info in the papers.   They'd love to publicly "shame" us for owning guns.  They made the list private to protect them.  They don't want us to know how many anti-gun politicians, their wives, their kids, etc. have carry permits.  I wouldn't be shocked if Loretta Winer and Steven Swiney were on the list.

[1LtCAP 4,262]

Yes, but it wasn't to protect us from having our private info in the papers.   They'd love to publicly "shame" us for owning guns.  They made the list private to protect them.  They don't want us to know how many anti-gun politicians, their wives, their kids, etc. have carry permits.  I wouldn't be shocked if Loretta Winer and Steven Swiney were on the list.

i'd say about 1200 more than likely.

[JohnnyB 4,323]

Yes, but it wasn't to protect us from having our private info in the papers.   They'd love to publicly "shame" us for owning guns.  They made the list private to protect them.  They don't want us to know how many anti-gun politicians, their wives, their kids, etc. have carry permits.  I wouldn't be shocked if Loretta Winer and Steven Swiney were on the list.

+ 1,000,000! God forbid they vote against a right for us yet exercise that same right for themselves!!!

[Newtonian 453]

I hear the objections -- remember the fuss over a newspaper publishing the locations of gun owners in Westchester Cty. a few years back? I wouldn't want to be part of a similar effort.

 

But there is a huge difference here. First of all that article targeted NY gun owners, not just handgun carry permit holders. Second unlike NJ, NY does issue carry permits to ordinary people. Most of those owners were like us, just people.

 

It's highly likely that 95% of the judges, prosecutors, ass-kissers, politicians, retired cops, and celebrities holding NJ carry permits don't believe in concealed carry for us, the little people. They believe their lives are more valuable than ours. These folks have arrested, jailed, fined, and made lives miserable for countless NJ gun owners.

Hypocrites always deserve to be outed.

 

In the future please post interesting stuff to the 1st Amendment Lounge where I can really say what's on my mind.

[Newtonian 453]

"If I can't have it, no one should" mentality.

Pardon me but that's a complete misreading of this issue.

 

"I can't have a billion dollars so Bill Gates should not" is the incorrect analogy. This is a matter of a certain class of individual having primacy over me, you, and everybody reading this. It's a matter of certain individuals declaring themselves to be separate, and "more equal." It's a matter above all of hypocrisy. 

 

In this state the issue is whose life is more valuable, who has more connections than me, who is able to dictate to whom. If it were up to me NOBODY would get a carry permit, even active police officers, until EVERYBODY had the right to one.

 

Get over the notion that you are inferior to certain other classes of people. I know, it's been drummed into your skull since you were a kid but get over it. It's not about earning something but about a basic human right that you are denied but the individuals you defend are not.

[Carcano 14]

Right so violate someones privacy because they can do something you can't?

[Newtonian 453]

Right so violate someones privacy because they can do something you can't?

Not the point. They can do something I can't ... not because of their extraordinary ability or through merit, something they've earned, but because they are members of a club. They are above the law as it's practiced and I'm below it. One set of rules for them, another one for me. The government treats them differently, more favorably, than me. They get a privilege that I don't get. And as they enjoy that privilege they deny it to me.

 

So yeah. Out them. Embarrass them. Put them on the evening news.

[Carcano 14]

Not the point. They can do something I can't ... not because of their extraordinary ability or through merit, something they've earned, but because they are members of a club. They are above the law as it's practiced and I'm below it. One set of rules for them, another one for me. The government treats them differently, more favorably, than me. They get a privilege that I don't get. And as they enjoy that privilege they deny it to me.

 

So yeah. Out them. Embarrass them. Put them on the evening news.

 

And if the someone released information for every FPID holder it wouldn't bother you? I wouldn't want someone finding out I own guns and where I live...just asking for a break-in.

 

Edit: And not every NJ CCW holder is above the law or politically connected, I know one who has no connections with any politicians or State officials.

[Newtonian 453]

And if the someone released information for every FPID holder it wouldn't bother you? I wouldn't want someone finding out I own guns and where I live...just asking for a break-in.

 

Edit: And not every NJ CCW holder is above the law or politically connected, I know one who has no connections with any politicians or State officials.

You're talking apples and oranges. The majority of FPID holders don't actively prevent others from receiving a card. The vast majority of carry permit holders in this state are anti-gun for us, pro-gun for themselves.

 

The break-in thing is ludicrous. Just about every "nice" house in this state contains jewelry or cars worth far more than most of our gun collections. You don't even need a map or an inventory, just break in if that's your thing.

 

If your acquaintance got his carry permit legitimately I would still be annoyed because, no matter what you say, he is treated differently than other people who apply. You know from my posts on former LEOs denied and the Almeida case that I am not keen on any of them being granted a privilege that would be denied to me. Justifiable need be damned. 

 

I have nothing against those individuals, nothing at all, but they are no better than me. They have no more right than I do. To accept that they do, or to play the game of justifiable need, is a travesty.

[fslater 62]

I didnt read every response so I hope this isn't redundant ..... the few that I did read kinda slam mipa..... actually I agree with him. Not for public opinion, but as proof that CCWs in NJ are issued as a matter solely of political privilege. Making it a matter of corruption and publicizing it as such nationally may force higher US courts to hear cases

[gleninjersey 2,139]

NOT a good idea.  Nobody else's business what or how many firearms I or anyone else own.

 

If you want to find out if particular public officials have a CCW couldn't you petition for that information for those individuals through the freedom of information act?  Possible see if conservative media will pose the question to them...and have them refuse to answer it.  Regardless if they have CCW permit they are hypocrites.  They have armed guards at their place of employment and more than likely have armed escorts/body guards.  That alone makes them a hypocrite.