What happens if currently owned black rifles are reclassified as NJ assault weapons

[PK90 3,570]

Licensed dealers in the four southwest border states subject to the multiple sales reporting requirement for certain rifles, have not received a letter notifying they are subject to the reporting requirement. Are they still required to submit the reports?

 

No. Licensees who are subject to the reporting requirement will receive a letter at the premises address indicated on your Federal firearms license notifying you of the reporting requirement and when you are required to begin submitting reports. The letter will be sent via certified mail. Do not submit multiple sales reports unless you receive specific direction from ATF to do so. If you moved to a different address and failed to notify the Federal Firearms Licensing Center (FFLC) as required by 27 C.F.R. § 478.52, you should immediately contact the FFLC at (866) 662-2750.

[mipafox 438]

 

You are right, IANAL but how would the State or Feds know? I wrote in my other post that I do not condone/recommend breaking the law...but, if no registry for rifles/shotguns exists HOW would they (State/Feds) know?

OK, first, I just read what I typed again and it looks like a-h*le, I apologize. I was trying to make a dramatic statement to get attention since this was horrible, illegal advice (albeit accidental).

 

Edit: And if his friend has a FPID it is legal..

No, IT'S NOT. Please stop.

 

You cannot transfer a firearm to a resident of a different state without an FFL unless somebody DIES.

 

Please go back and edit your half dozen posts, with that many erroneous posts it is inevitable someone will miss the couple posts correcting the facts.

[Midwest 28]

It is ok to bring a firearm to an FFL in a different state.

 

[mipafox 438]

It is ok to bring a firearm to an FFL in a different state.

It seems that was likely in response to me, if so, can you explain the relevance? Thanks.

[Midwest 28]

It saves money on shipping if seller and buyer live close to each other but in separate states. While of course there is the FFL fee, there is no additional shipping fee.  Most of us are aware of this, it might be news and useful to someone running across this info the first time.

[mipafox 438]

Thank you!

[Carcano 14]

 

OK, first, I just read what I typed again and it looks like a-h*le, I apologize. I was trying to make a dramatic statement to get attention since this was horrible, illegal advice (albeit accidental).

 

 

No, IT'S NOT. Please stop.

 

You cannot transfer a firearm to a resident of a different state without an FFL unless somebody DIES.

 

Please go back and edit your half dozen posts, with that many erroneous posts it is inevitable someone will miss the couple posts correcting the facts.

 

No, it's not illegal if the friend is also a resident of NJ.

 

Let's assume the friend has a home in both NJ and PA and also has an FPID and NJ DL, the friend could fill out the NJ COE and take possession of it.

 

But YOU still haven't answered the question, Mipa, how would NJSP or ATF KNOW the long gun was no longer in his possession and in PA? if the long guns are not registered how would NJSP/ATF know?

[mipafox 438]

 

No, it's not illegal if the friend is also a resident of NJ.

Where did you say that?

 

Let's assume the friend has a home in both NJ and PA and also has an FPID and NJ DL, the friend could fill out the NJ COE and take possession of it.

You're making up new stuff now. Like I said, please NEVER tell anyone they can transfer longguns to residents of other states. Or that it would be OK if they had an NJ FPID.

 

But YOU still haven't answered the question, Mipa, how would NJSP or ATF KNOW the long gun was no longer in his possession and in PA? if the long guns are not registered how would NJSP/ATF know?

I still haven't answered what question? I never obliged your illegal ideas, nor your entirely illegal advice proposed as legal advice.

 

You want an answer? It's called a trace. Is your illegal AR-15 or whatever you are giving to some friend in PA that is willing to commit a federal crime to enable your evasion of dumbass NJ gun laws something that your great granddady bought back in 1930? Is that when the NJ illegal firearm was shipped from the factory?

 

I guaran-Finng-tee you if the cops come across that firearm and have a good reason to want to know who it belongs to, your FFL you give you up under a trace, or the guy who owned it before you will tell them it is you rather than holding the bag to protect your illegal activities.

 

This discussion has gone from you giving people advice that could put them in jail, to you giving more advice that could put people in jail, to you now defending advice that could put people in jail under the auspices of there being no way of getting caught, when you are damn right people would be caught if the cops wanted them.

 

What exactly are you trying to do here?

 

What do you want from me? Do you want me to teach you how to illegally transfer firearms with the least chance of getting caught? I don't know anything about that, and it's clear you REALLY don't.

 

Why don't you just carry a handgun in NJ every day? When is the last time you got patted down by a cop? I knew people back in the day that carried handguns for years and never got caught. Perhaps you should start there and move up to federal crimes later.

 

JUST STOP ADVISING PEOPLE TO UNWITTINGLY GO TO JAIL WITH YOU.

[Carcano 14]

 

Where did you say that?

 

 

You're making up new stuff now. Like I said, please NEVER tell anyone they can transfer longguns to residents of other states. Or that it would be OK if they had an NJ FPID.

 

 

I still haven't answered what question? I never obliged your illegal ideas, nor your entirely illegal advice proposed as legal advice.

 

You want an answer? It's called a trace. Is your illegal AR-15 or whatever you are giving to some friend in PA that is willing to commit a federal crime to enable your evasion of dumbass NJ gun laws something that your great granddady bought back in 1930? Is that when the NJ illegal firearm was shipped from the factory?

 

I guaran-Finng-tee you if the cops come across that firearm and have a good reason to want to know who it belongs to, your FFL you give you up under a trace, or the guy who owned it before you will tell them it is you rather than holding the bag to protect your illegal activities.

 

This discussion has gone from you giving people advice that could put them in jail, to you giving more advice that could put people in jail, to you now defending advice that could put people in jail under the auspices of there being no way of getting caught, when you are damn right people would be caught if the cops wanted them.

 

What exactly are you trying to do here?

 

What do you want from me? Do you want me to teach you how to illegally transfer firearms with the least chance of getting caught? I don't know anything about that, and it's clear you REALLY don't.

 

Why don't you just carry a handgun in NJ every day? When is the last time you got patted down by a cop? I knew people back in the day that carried handguns for years and never got caught. Perhaps you should start there and move up to federal crimes later.

 

JUST STOP ADVISING PEOPLE TO UNWITTINGLY GO TO JAIL WITH YOU.

 

I posted that IANAL (I am not a lawyer) and that you were right and I was wrong to suggest it.

 

I also posted that I do not condone this (breaking the law) look at page(s) 6 and 5.

 

I pointed out the fact that if guns are not registered LE wouldn't know who the owner is. Yes, you are right LE could do a trace and find out where the manufacturer sent it and where the distributor sent it and so on until they find the FFL that logged it out and pull out the 4473 identifying the buyer. Is this likely? NO! unless the firearm turns up in a crime I doubt it will ever see a trace.

 

No, I don't want you to "teach me" how to transfer firearms illegally with "the least chance of getting caught". Again, I posted that I do not recommend/condone this and this was all hypothetical.

[1LtCAP 4,263]

so what you guys are saying, is that if my friend lets me put a small safe in their spare room, bolt it to the floor, lock my guns in it, and no one other than myself has the combination, that's illegal? they're not in their possession, as they cannot access them. they are stored securely, and only i can access them. there would be no ammo or mags stored with them. just the guns.

[DeerSlayer 241]

The major reason she made all the non resident permits null, is mainly to prevent PA residents from using them instead of applying for a PALTC. Just happened to also affect all of us here as well that like to travel to Pa.

[PK90 3,570]

so what you guys are saying, is that if my friend lets me put a small safe in their spare room, bolt it to the floor, lock my guns in it, and no one other than myself has the combination, that's illegal? they're not in their possession, as they cannot access them. they are stored securely, and only i can access them. there would be no ammo or mags stored with them. just the guns.

 

What law says where or where not one can store their firearms? Store away.

[Midwest 28]

The only laws regarding storing firearms I am aware of.

 

Some counties in New York State require that if permit holders more handguns than a certain amount (some arbitrary number),  the authorities can demand to see a safe before they allow any more handguns on their permit.

 

The other one is "Felon in Possession of a Firearm" laws and concerns about proximity to firearms and ammo even if they are locked in a safe. One forum says it is OK to do this, another forum says it is still illegal.

 

Some state laws might require locking up of firearms when not in use.

 

Some areas might require an FFL to have safe.

[mipafox 438]

 

so what you guys are saying, is that if my friend lets me put a small safe in their spare room, bolt it to the floor, lock my guns in it, and no one other than myself has the combination, that's illegal? they're not in their possession, as they cannot access them. they are stored securely, and only i can access them. there would be no ammo or mags stored with them. just the guns.

 

 

I believe it is 100% legal. I also suggest you convince yourself it is legal, perhaps with real legal advice or research.

[1LtCAP 4,263]

   

 

I believe it is 100% legal. I also suggest you convince yourself it is legal, perhaps with real legal advice or research.

as that time moves closer, i will do just this.

[mipafox 438]

The major reason she made all the non resident permits null, is mainly to prevent PA residents from using them instead of applying for a PALTC. Just happened to also affect all of us here as well that like to travel to Pa.

PA Court ruled (binding case law) that PA residents can only carry under LTCF. Kane continued to cancel non-resident reciprocity with Utah and several other states. None of which would have prevented people in PA from carrying under out of state licenses.

 

There is a conspiracy theory, literally, and I happen to believe it. Kane has a history with both the NJ AG and the NJSP Commissioner at the time. Supposedly, both were highly pissed that NJ subjects were carrying guns right next door in Pennsylvania and asked Kane if she could put a stop to it while she was spending Bloomberg money to deal with the "Philly Loophole."

 

I 100% believe this. Every change in reciprocity she made can be reversed with the snap of two fingers by the next AG, yet she spent a year on these ILLEGAL acts (she has no authority to limit reciprocity) after case law existed barring PA residents from carrying on out of state licenses - the latter of which would require opening up the PA Uniform Firearms Act to overcome.

 

The only possible reason she was doing this was to keep people from out of state from carrying in PA, and I believe it was at the beckoning of NJ.

[DeerSlayer 241]

PA Court ruled (binding case law) that PA residents can only carry under LTCF. Kane continued to cancel non-resident reciprocity with Utah and several other states. None of which would have prevented people in PA from carrying under out of state licenses.

 

There is a conspiracy theory, literally, and I happen to believe it. Kane has a history with both the NJ AG and the NJSP Commissioner at the time. Supposedly, both were highly pissed that NJ subjects were carrying guns right next door in Pennsylvania and asked Kane if she could put a stop to it while she was spending Bloomberg money to deal with the "Philly Loophole."

 

I 100% believe this. Every change in reciprocity she made can be reversed with the snap of two fingers by the next AG, yet she spent a year on these ILLEGAL acts (she has no authority to limit reciprocity) after case law existed barring PA residents from carrying on out of state licenses - the latter of which would require opening up the PA Uniform Firearms Act to overcome.

 

The only possible reason she was doing this was to keep people from out of state from carrying in PA, and I believe it was at the beckoning of NJ.

I buy that.

[1LtCAP 4,263]

PA Court ruled (binding case law) that PA residents can only carry under LTCF. Kane continued to cancel non-resident reciprocity with Utah and several other states. None of which would have prevented people in PA from carrying under out of state licenses.

 

There is a conspiracy theory, literally, and I happen to believe it. Kane has a history with both the NJ AG and the NJSP Commissioner at the time. Supposedly, both were highly pissed that NJ subjects were carrying guns right next door in Pennsylvania and asked Kane if she could put a stop to it while she was spending Bloomberg money to deal with the "Philly Loophole."

 

I 100% believe this. Every change in reciprocity she made can be reversed with the snap of two fingers by the next AG, yet she spent a year on these ILLEGAL acts (she has no authority to limit reciprocity) after case law existed barring PA residents from carrying on out of state licenses - the latter of which would require opening up the PA Uniform Firearms Act to overcome.

 

The only possible reason she was doing this was to keep people from out of state from carrying in PA, and I believe it was at the beckoning of NJ.

that does sound like conspiracy theory.......not sure if i buy it or not, but wouldn't be surprised. kinda surprised you buy into any conspiracy theory. you generally don't seem to do that.......

[GRIZ 3,369]

No, it's not illegal if the friend is also a resident of NJ.

 

Let's assume the friend has a home in both NJ and PA and also has an FPID and NJ DL, the friend could fill out the NJ COE and take possession of it.

 

But YOU still haven't answered the question, Mipa, how would NJSP or ATF KNOW the long gun was no longer in his possession and in PA? if the long guns are not registered how would NJSP/ATF know?

That transfer wouldn't be legal as it still is an out of state transfer. NJ law stops at NJ borders. You can't export state law to another state. If some law were to pass there would be a few months for it to take effect. It would not go into effect the next day. Using the same people in your scenario they could make the transfer in NJ and your friend could take the rifle to PA.

[mipafox 438]

that does sound like conspiracy theory.......not sure if i buy it or not, but wouldn't be surprised. kinda surprised you buy into any conspiracy theory. you generally don't seem to do that.......

What reason did she have to keep doing this for a year after PA residents lost all rights to carry on out of state licenses under case law? I was watching it happening over the course of a year and I couldn't figure out why. People here were bitching and moaning (appropriately) and I kept telling people there is no reason for her to do this.

 

I got the story from an inside source that has no stake or interest in this but also not a person I know or have any way to vouch the reliability of. In other words, it could be complete BS.

 

BTW, why did she stop when she got to Texas? She knocked out every single state that allows people without a license from their own state to get a license except NH (which passed a rule changing that) and Texas. Texas, which would require an NJ resident to actually train in Texas to get the permit.

[1LtCAP 4,263]

i dunno man. what i DO know.....is that it would almost be worth the money and trip to tx to be able to do that, just as a big fuck you to her and the powers that be in nj........

[mipafox 438]

i dunno man. what i DO know.....is that it would almost be worth the money and trip to tx to be able to do that, just as a big fuck you to her and the powers that be in nj........

You know this. She was hired as PA AG by Bloomberg, bought and paid for. Because Bloomberg wanted to close the "Florida Loophole" allowing residents of Philly to carry when Philly likes to deny people they don't like and hope they don't have the time or money to go to court over it.

 

That's not a conspiracy theory, those are FACTS. If Bloomberg didn't pay for her to be AG, she would not be AG, period. And he did it for Philly. Why does Bloomberg care about Philly?

 

Well, why would Kane care about Jersey once Philly and ALL of PA was over with?

 

The FACTS are this is not Pennsylvania politics, it is New York politics.

[Carcano 14]

You know this. She was hired as PA AG by Bloomberg, bought and paid for. Because Bloomberg wanted to close the "Florida Loophole" allowing residents of Philly to carry when Philly likes to deny people they don't like and hope they don't have the time or money to go to court over it.

 

That's not a conspiracy theory, those are FACTS. If Bloomberg didn't pay for her to be AG, she would not be AG, period. And he did it for Philly. Why does Bloomberg care about Philly?

 

Well, why would Kane care about Jersey once Philly and ALL of PA was over with?

 

The FACTS are this is not Pennsylvania politics, it is New York politics.

 

Wait, even after bringing up politics this thread still hasn't made it to the sandbox?

 

Sorry, continue on...

[Walt of Destiny 412]

,m

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[1LtCAP 4,263]

they would have to allow you to register them...but would you?

get ready...it's coming. Especially with the morons doing a recall on the senate president 

while i understand that we need/needed to try SOMEthing.......what they did is pretty much what guaranteed us the njsafe act in 2017

[Zeke 5,504]

while i understand that we need/needed to try SOMEthing.......what they did is pretty much what guaranteed us the njsafe act in 2017

Right...... We probaly shouldn't fight Isis either. Don't want them to terrorize us more than normal.....

[Kevin125 4,772]

Their bills are coming regardless of what 2A groups do.

 

And when they do, massive unrest needs to be the response. Disruptive revolt... Not..... a 'civil conversation'. Not saying hurt anyone. But the govt needs to be shut down as they are not representing us. They are enslaving us.

[1LtCAP 4,263]

  

 

Just came across this......

 

Seems you shouldn't pick a fight that you cannot 100 pcnt win..... it's just bad tactics.

 

 

Just like the adage a lawyer doesn't ask a question they don't already know the answer too

and that was my point all along. i went silent about it, 'cause i seemed to be in the minority with my criticism of it. if they'd have gone after smaller fish, it might've worked better.......

[Kevin125 4,772]

Cap. I think it made him more arrogant.  But ultimately he would do the same stuff.

 

In hindsight, the whole recall thing may have been an impossible mission.  The numbers required seemed to me like we would have to get virtually every likely voter who voted against him in the previous election.  Which is all but impossible. I think the rules are set up so that it's impossible to recall anyone in this state.  If that is true, then it was a horrible idea and makes the 2A crowd seem weak.  And normally, that would embolden someone to reach high to screw us like you're saying.  But in his case, he is the exception in that he is such a F&^%#@ing arrogant scum bag thug, that I think he plans to screw us no matter what.  Assuming either he or some other D is governor.

 

With or without that failed recall, we would see the SAFE Act, then they'd try registration of all guns, then then banning of all semi auto rifles, then banning non-SMart handguns.  Then banning having guns in your home.  Then banning all guns.

 

Only thing that will stop them is an more informed public telling them to stop.

 

edit: And I see them -trying- to do this over 10 years or so. Assuming they can keep a Dem gov for that amount of time.  I'm not sure they'll even get one next term.