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Samdjr74

Can my wife use my handguns?

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Hi all,

 

I didn't find a topic that covered this exactly so I figured I'd ask. I just got my wife into shooting and she really likes it. She's going for her FID soon so she can get her own guns. Right now she is using mine when we go to the range. My question is when she get's her FID can she go to the range by herself with one of my handguns or does she need to have her own?

 

Thanks,

Sam

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No, but ...... who would know or care?

 

My wife would. She doesn't break the law, ever. If the speed limit is 65 she does 65, no more no less.

 

I can't say that's a bad thing but she sometimes takes it to the extreme.

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Well, this might sound a bit crazy, but if one of you were to go to Dixon's Muzzleloading in Kempton, PA and buy a muzzleloading gun (pistol, revolver, rifle or scattergun) that uses black powder, you can safely transport it LEGALLY to and from a range with ZERO paperwork AT ALL..........  In fact, either of you could go TODAY and buy as many as you wish since PA doesn't consider them guns at all!

 

But as Paul (PK-90) said, who would know or care?  

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if she happens to get pulled over, get in accident, have medical emergency etc.. and the guns are discovered shes in a world of hurt.

 

You are not the ones going to be dealing with the consequences so don't give bad advice. We are talking Handguns here not long guns. As shitty as it is, thems the brakes kiddo.

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if she happens to get pulled over, get in accident, have medical emergency etc.. and the guns are discovered shes in a world of hurt.

 

You are not the ones going to be dealing with the consequences so don't give bad advice. We are talking Handguns here not long guns. As shitty as it is, thems the brakes kiddo.

"World of Hurt" ? Take it from the other side at one time, we don't care, referring to your senario.

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Well, this might sound a bit crazy, but if one of you were to go to Dixon's Muzzleloading in Kempton, PA and buy a muzzleloading gun (pistol, revolver, rifle or scattergun) that uses black powder, you can safely transport it LEGALLY to and from a range with ZERO paperwork AT ALL..........  In fact, either of you could go TODAY and buy as many as you wish since PA doesn't consider them guns at all!

 

 

You mean, carry it in the glovebox like that guy, Van Gilder with the flintlock from the 1700s?   You know, the one that took a huge public outcry before the prosecutor would drop the charges?

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Well, this might sound a bit crazy, but if one of you were to go to Dixon's Muzzleloading in Kempton, PA and buy a muzzleloading gun (pistol, revolver, rifle or scattergun) that uses black powder, you can safely transport it LEGALLY to and from a range with ZERO paperwork AT ALL..........  In fact, either of you could go TODAY and buy as many as you wish since PA doesn't consider them guns at all!

 

But as Paul (PK-90) said, who would know or care?  

 

Would you be so kind as to cite the NJ Statute that provides an exception which allows for such transport of a pistol?

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if she happens to get pulled over, get in accident, have medical emergency etc.. and the guns are discovered shes in a world of hurt.

 

You are not the ones going to be dealing with the consequences so don't give bad advice. We are talking Handguns here not long guns. As shitty as it is, thems the brakes kiddo.

You are correct (somewhat) if the guns are centerfire plastic fantastics.  But no case law yet exists where a wife was charged with possession of tangible personal property 1/2 owned by her through marriage!  

 

If the modern hand gun(s) was willed to her (no paperwork), purchased out of state by her OR her spouse or partner (and then moved here to PRNJ), given to her by her Daddy who fought in WW2 (now suffering from dementia and SHE has power of attorney), she can go use the thing all she wants LEGALLY!

 

If she decides to own a Cap and Ball revolver while waiting for her NJFPID she may also do THAT, and stick to the "only to and from" rules for hand guns.

 

Not every situation has the nuances I just wrote about, but for some reason, here in this forum we always tend to "fill-in" any missing part of the story with the worst possible scenarios...

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You mean, carry it in the glovebox like that guy, Van Gilder with the flintlock from the 1700s?   You know, the one that took a huge public outcry before the prosecutor would drop the charges?

 

LOL!  Did I say glovebox?  I fail to see the reason for your quip.  Or are you just misinformed about how I can expertly read the letter and intent of NJ gun laws?  

 

Transportation of firearms merely requires that they be secured and empty if one is not a NJFPID card holder.  My famous example of 100 naked, unloaded, uncased, non-trigger locked EVIL DEATH MACHINES (hand guns) tossed into my Grand Marquis' voluminous trunk (so as to enable themselves to scratch the ever-loving crap out of each other with every bump in the road) and then closing the trunk deck lid qualifies as being "secured".  

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Would you be so kind as to cite the NJ Statute that provides an exception which allows for such transport of a pistol?

NO!  I grow bored with folks who don't read (or won't bother to read) the laws for themselves.  Vlad wrote War and Peace and pinned it to this legal sub-forum for all to read...

 

Here's a test of applied deduction:  If I move from out of state into the PRNJ with a 200 gun collection (nothing NJ banned) I don't have to register ANY of it!  I'm allowed to secure it and transport any of it to ranges, matches, gunsmiths' locations, etc. so long as I observe "directly to and from" and stay out of "Gun Free Zones" like schools and military bases.  Same as non-resident competitive shooters (of any shooting discipline) coming into NJ with hand guns OR long guns!  A NJFPID card is only needed for PURCHASING THINGS THAT GO BANG while your two feet are located INSIDE NJ.  Since muzzleloading firearms aren't treated as firearms in PA (for instance), you may, as a NJ resident, fill-up your trunk with them.  They only become evil Death machines at the border crossing, lol.  Since centerfire arms are considered firearms in all states, they would need sent to a NJ FFL for a transfer (with all of the appropriate paperwork) as has been written about here on this forum in thousands of posts.

 

Now extrapolate having some black powder firearms (legally purchased out of state) unloaded and secured in the trunk of your vehicle.  Without NJFPID card I merely go "directly to and from"....

 

NJ Gun Law has to be interpreted as A + B = C.  "A" says all guns are illegal, "B" lists the EXEMPTIONS, and "C" is the net result (the allowable way to DISREGARD WRITTEN LAW) of the nuance of applying and interpreting the statutes as a "whole".

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You are correct (somewhat) if the guns are centerfire plastic fantastics.  But no case law yet exists where a wife was charged with possession of tangible personal property 1/2 owned by her through marriage!  

 

If the modern hand gun(s) was willed to her (no paperwork), purchased out of state by her OR her spouse or partner (and then moved here to PRNJ), given to her by her Daddy who fought in WW2 (now suffering from dementia and SHE has power of attorney), she can go use the thing all she wants LEGALLY!

 

If she decides to own a Cap and Ball revolver while waiting for her NJFPID she may also do THAT, and stick to the "only to and from" rules for hand guns.

 

Not every situation has the nuances I just wrote about, but for some reason, here in this forum we always tend to "fill-in" any missing part of the story with the worst possible scenarios...

 

So if a person is waiting for their FPID, they can go to PA, buy a muzzleloader and legally posses and use it in the state of NJ?

 

 

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So if a person is waiting for their FPID, they can go to PA, buy a muzzleloader and legally posses and use it in the state of NJ?

 

 

In a word, YES!  But you are subjected to the same rules and laws that govern possession and transportation of evil death machines, because NJ considers a BB gun to be a hand gun!  So as long as they're not a Felon, or some other type of Prohibited Person, Wife Beater, etc., etc., you're allowed to exercise your freedom.  Just don't get T-Boned driving-around with a Cap and Ball revolver (even an unloaded one) while you're "going here and there" flitting-around town doing errands.  So use common sense.

 

If I'm a hunter from Wyoming that can make 600 yard kills on deer, shouldn't I be allowed to use my Mossberg 500 and some rifled slugs on NJ deer so long as I have a NJ hunting license?  Did you know that a NJ hunting license allows transport of your hunting guns w/o "directly to and from"?

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LOL!  Did I say glovebox?  I fail to see the reason for your quip.  Or are you just misinformed about how I can expertly read the letter and intent of NJ gun laws?  

 

 

I completely agree with you, I brought a bunch of NJ legal guns with me from Ohio and didn't register any of them.  I didn't get my FPID until 2009, 13 years after I moved to NJ.   Your statement comes off as a bit capricious, as in...there's no rules or regs to it because it's black powder and can be purchased in PA.     If you transport it within the exemptions, you're correct and I've argued this point ad naseum as well.  You don't need a FPID card to transport firearms in NJ to exempted places and even if you have a FPID, it confers no legality to handguns whatsoever other than identifying that you have an SBI number.

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Smoking 50,

It was not a quip, simply a question.  The reason I asked is because I thought you may be privy to some information or statute of NJ gun law regarding transport outside exempted areas that I am unaware of.  Normally I would not have asked a question but due to the circumstances one may encounter transporting a gun in this Godforsaken state, I thought it best to get a clarification from you.

Now that I see your response, I am sorry I asked.

Thanks......Tom

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Can someone quote the section of the statute that specifies someone with an FID can't transport a handgun owned by someone else? I have searched and can't find it. I have never seen ownership specified in any of the exceptions.

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Hi all,

 

I didn't find a topic that covered this exactly so I figured I'd ask. I just got my wife into shooting and she really likes it. She's going for her FID soon so she can get her own guns. Right now she is using mine when we go to the range. My question is when she get's her FID can she go to the range by herself with one of my handguns or does she need to have her own?

 

Thanks,

Sam

 

Unfortunately legally she cannot use handguns registered in your name at the range without you being there. I know it sucks, but that's the law.

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You guys have pretty much hashed out the legality of it.  But, it is EVERYONE'S responsibility to know and follow the law.  Broken gun laws in NJ result in felonies and jail time.   And, many officers of the law are either anti-Constitution, or they are ignorant of the law and arrest first and sort it out later.  So, even if you know the law, you are at risk in the Republik.  And, it appears Christie only pardons once or twice a year when it might be politically expedient.

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I completely agree with you, I brought a bunch of NJ legal guns with me from Ohio and didn't register any of them.  I didn't get my FPID until 2009, 13 years after I moved to NJ.   Your statement comes off as a bit capricious, as in...there's no rules or regs to it because it's black powder and can be purchased in PA.     If you transport it within the exemptions, you're correct and I've argued this point ad naseum as well.  You don't need a FPID card to transport firearms in NJ to exempted places and even if you have a FPID, it confers no legality to handguns whatsoever other than identifying that you have an SBI number.

YES!

 

My arthritis prevents me from writing War and Peace with every post.  Didn't mean to come-off capricious or terse.

 

Dave

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Unfortunately legally she cannot use handguns registered in your name at the range without you being there. I know it sucks, but that's the law.

Is the issue that NJ considers possession an illegal transfer? Not trying to be a wise guy, it just never occurred to me that this would be an issue.

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Unfortunately legally she cannot use handguns registered in your name at the range without you being there. I know it sucks, but that's the law.

Ok not to be a smart @$$, if she legally can not use a hand gun registered to me why is it ok for her to rent and shoot a hand gun owned and registered to the range? Again I'm not trying to start a fight just wondering.

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Ok not to be a smart @$$, if she legally can not use a hand gun registered to me why is it ok for her to rent and shoot a hand gun owned and registered to the range? Again I'm not trying to start a fight just wondering.

Never mind I think I answered my own question. The range is the legal owner and she is using it at the range hence she would be covered

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Is the issue that NJ considers possession an illegal transfer? Not trying to be a wise guy, it just never occurred to me that this would be an issue.

In a word, YES!

 

But as I previously posted, there is ZERO case law where a wife was arrested or charged for transporting tangible personal property (even GUNS!), the value of which would be split in a divorce!

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Ok not to be a smart @$$, if she legally can not use a hand gun registered to me why is it ok for her to rent and shoot a hand gun owned and registered to the range? Again I'm not trying to start a fight just wondering.

And FWIW, some Philadelphia lawyers here think that if your wife gets to YOUR gun to shoot a Perp (who hit her in the head with a hammer and ripped her panties off) she's guilty of an "illegal transfer"!  

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And FWIW, some Philadelphia lawyers here think that if your wife gets to YOUR gun to shoot a Perp (who hit her in the head with a hammer and ripped her panties off) she's guilty of an "illegal transfer"!  

Lovely, I'd like to see the bad press the courts would get from a case like that.

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And FWIW, some Philadelphia lawyers here think that if your wife gets to YOUR gun to shoot a Perp (who hit her in the head with a hammer and ripped her panties off) she's guilty of an "illegal transfer"!  

 

 That was my next question... thanks.

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Lovely, I'd like to see the bad press the courts would get from a case like that.

So would I!  This is why I always tell folks to use their brains when it comes to the nuances of firearms ownership.  Look, you can "what-if" yourself to death.  

 

I never asked you when/where/how you got your hand guns.  I wrote examples outlining some of the nuance involved in coming to the entire correct conclusion.  If you just moved to NJ from out of state (for instance), those unregistered Death Machines could be transported by either spouse, as in Free America they're considered matrimonial property.  If you're brand-new at this, a NJ resident and want ZERO risk, then she waits for her own paperwork to clear.  But in the meantime, please have her willing to protect her own life with YOUR STUFF until her paperwork clears!

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So would I!  This is why I always tell folks to use their brains when it comes to the nuances of firearms ownership.  Look, you can "what-if" yourself to death.  

 

I never asked you when/where/how you got your hand guns.  I wrote examples outlining some of the nuance involved in coming to the entire correct conclusion.  If you just moved to NJ from out of state (for instance), those unregistered Death Machines could be transported by either spouse, as in Free America they're considered matrimonial property.  If you're brand-new at this, a NJ resident and want ZERO risk, then she waits for her own paperwork to clear.  But in the meantime, please have her willing to protect her own life with YOUR STUFF until her paperwork clears!

 

So just to clear up the details I purchased all the guns here in NJ. The guns of course being mentioned are hand guns, (she doesn't like my rifles) And one gun in particular which is a Ruger Single 10, she enjoys shooting that one over anything else I own. 

 

As far as waiting, she's ok with that for the range but I have shown her how to load and protect herself with all of my guns.

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