Another PA man faces NJ gun charges

[Howard 538]

http://www.nj.com/burlington/index.ssf/2015/11/pa_man_jailed_for_having_handgun_in_nj_without_pro.html

 

A Pennsylvania man was arrested Sunday after city police found him in a vehicle with a loaded handgun placed between the front seats. While the man had a permit to carry said weapon in Pennsylvania, he didn't have the same privilege in the Garden State.

 

Long passed time to have carry permits valid in all 50 states, just like driver's licenses.

[robot_hell 72]

http://www.nj.com/burlington/index.ssf/2015/11/pa_man_jailed_for_having_handgun_in_nj_without_pro.html

 

A Pennsylvania man was arrested Sunday after city police found him in a vehicle with a loaded handgun placed between the front seats. While the man had a permit to carry said weapon in Pennsylvania, he didn't have the same privilege in the Garden State.

 

Long passed time to have carry permits valid in all 50 states, just like driver's licenses.

Careful, though, that means federal involvement.

[maintenanceguy 510]

FROM THE ARTICLE: "According to New Jersey State Police, a firearm being transported must be unloaded and inside a closed case or locked in the trunk of a vehicle.

 

Further, the firearm can't be "directly accessible" from the passenger compartment of the vehicle and can't be in the glove compartment or console if the vehicle doesn't have a compartment separate from where the motorists sit."

 

B.S.   That's not NJ law.  The State Police are getting bolder in their campaign of mis-information about NJ gun laws.  They're intentionally trying to make them even more strict than they actually are.

 

I wonder how long it will be before the courts start to use the NJSP version instead of the actual law

 

Careful, though, that means federal involvement.

We already have a federal law that should cover this. Passed in 1781 and still on the books.

[jackandjill 683]

Checkin the maps, Rt 130 (and Wawas on it) is only few miles off the border at most.   This is similar to that stunt MA and ATF pulled on NH Man few miles off the border.

 

These anti 2A states should just declare separation from Union and issue their own passports with border control. That way they can protect and preserve their precious "laws". 

 

Ridiculous. 

[tattooo 220]

He wont be the last to get screwed in NJ

[Howard 538]

Careful, though, that means federal involvement.

Why does that mean Federal involvement?  Driver's licenses are administered by individual states only, but are honored in all 50 states.

[Bt Doctur 188]

So just how do you qualify for a CCW permit and NOT KNOW THE LAWS IN OTHER STATES?

That's not a lapse of judgement, ITS PLAIN STUPID

[kirk2022 43]

+1 to the post above (my quote dosnt work)

How many of you guys that carry with A Non Resident permit are unaware of the laws in the States that you carry in?

I know them and if I screw up I pay the price.

 

Tough on him, Know the laws where you are!

[tattooo 220]

It's true that ccw holders should be mindful of other states laws

[RecessedFilter 222]

Any resident from a surrounding Nj state like PA/DE/VA etc must be living on another planet to not know that they should stay out of NJ with any sort of CCW or firearm nonetheless. That doesn't mean I still feel it sucks for this guy, but as this happens more and more, out of state residents really need to start realizing they need to be better informed on NJ/other states gun laws.

[jackandjill 683]

How ?    Here is how...

 

Certain things are perfectly legal in NJ with FPID, but not in NY State. ... I am driving with them, except certain roads here on north border go over and turn right at the border. There is no other way except to take that highway to goto certain places in NJ. 

 

That means its real easy to end up on the other side of the line and suddenly become a "Felon" having to spend suitcase of money in best case and worthy of years of jail time worse case.  Road constructions, detours, visibility issues and missed exit, disoriented due to health issues etc... 

 

You are going to love this.. only way to come back to NJ is a U turn at  next exit thats about 5 miles out into NY State. So should I drive back wards ?  Stop, take my NJ legal stuff and walk back ?  Stop and call police to come help ?   Go further into damn NY and risk getting shafted under SAFE ACT ?

 

Lets come down from the pedestal little bit. Most of us DO NOT know 1000 ways one can get locked up just on the other side of the road. 

 

 

Did he commit a violent crime depriving others of their life, liberty or property ? NO. Write him a $500 ticket at worse and call it a day. 

[mipafox 438]

You guys are complete jackasses. You live in a commie state and assume everybody else should know it. And yet half the people in this very thread don't know the laws regarding possession of hollowpoints in your own damn state. Queue the "they are legal unless you commit a crime," after 6 years you still don't know your own laws.

 

How many of you think you can possess a handgun but there are restrictions on transportation? You are wrong, and you should all spend 5 to 10 years in prison.

 

How many gun owners in Jersey think they can bring a handgun to their parents' house, or their brother's house, or their inlaws' house, as long as they lock it in the trunk and "keep ammo separate?" I would bet 99% of gun owners in Jersey do not know that it's 5 to 10 years in jail to possess a handgun at a relative's house, regardless of how it got there. If you walk it next door in pieces locked in a box with no ammo it's 5 to 10 years in prison.

 

If every one of you was caught by cops at the worst moment in the next 30 days, a double digit percentage opf the people in this thread would go to jail.

 

There are 1 million gun owners in NJ. How many are registered on NJGunforums? You guys don't even know the laws, no matter how many times you are beaten over the head with them.

 

I think every person that throws a stone in this thread should be subject to scrutiny by a judge of their knowledge of your own NJ gun laws if you ever miss anything.

 

I would love to see you held to the standards in front of the court that you hold others too. I know a good number of you in this thread would fail and jail.

 

Great job supporting your fellow legal gun owners.

[tattooo 220]

Well said Mipa !

[njpilot 671]

+1

[Scorpio64 5,147]

Any resident from a surrounding Nj state like PA/DE/VA etc must be living on another planet to not know that they should stay out of NJ with any sort of CCW or firearm nonetheless. That doesn't mean I still feel it sucks for this guy, but as this happens more and more, out of state residents really need to start realizing they need to be better informed on NJ/other states gun laws.

 

^^^^^

Yup.

 

I think enough CCWers have gotten busted in NJ for the word to have gotten out by now.  There are at least two cases that made national headlines.  Nobody has to like the laws here, but they have to follow them.  My gut tells me that this PA CCW holder was almost certainly aware of NJ's draconian laws, he chose to take his chances, and lost.  Claiming, or feigning ignorance can only work so many times.

[kman 56]

I think many here would be surprised at the number of non-gun laws that exist that they violate all the time and don't even know it.

 

There are ordinary people out there, they get a license for a gun, they have a license, they think everything is ok.  There's their license.  They have other things in their life they focus more on.

 

The problem is a lot of people assume that the law comports with common sense, and figure if they act reasonably they are ok.  And for a long time, they get away with it.  Some get away with it their whole lives.  Some get caught, and learn the lesson the hard way that the law has very little to do with common sense.

[Newtonian 453]

So just how do you qualify for a CCW permit and NOT KNOW THE LAWS IN OTHER STATES?

That's not a lapse of judgement, ITS PLAIN 

Do you know the difference between legal and moral? 

 

Do you know how easy it is to break state or federal laws, for example, and that the conviction rate for the latter is 93%? Would you say "tough shit" to someone who was fined $50,000 a day for draining a swamp in his back yard, who accidentally killed some freaking endangered snake, who collected rainwater on his own property, or possessed a lobster under a certain length? 

 

Do you know how weird and outer-worldly our gun laws are to people in most states? 

 

NJ residents are like captives. We've been beaten down so long we eventually come to like our oppressors. It's called the Stockholm syndrome.

[maintenanceguy 510]

We are our own worst enemy. No wonder NJ's gun laws just keep getting worse. We've been oppressed for so long that we have started to believe it's okay, we like it this way. It's comfortable now.

A guy from the rest of America comes to the most unconstitutionally oppressive state in the nation - where this constitutionally guaranteed civil right is absolutely denied. I'd be disgusted if half the gun owners in NJ said it's his own fault - NJ's laws are okay and he should have known to follow them. I'm enraged that half the NJ gun owners who are involved in gun culture enough to be active members here feel that way.

This is why I have decided that I'm not fighting any more and we've decided to move instead. No more rally's. No more recalls. No more trips to Trenton. No more phone calls or emails. No more letters to the editor. No more OPRA requests. No more public comments on changes to the Administrative Code. I'm done fighting for the rights of other gun owners who like it better this way.  I'm done fighting for gun owners who fight against those of us who want change things. I don't understand the mindset but it's clear that the majority of gun owners in NJ prefer our system just the way it is.

Every time someone here posts an idea for getting things changed, everyone else pounces - scared of upsetting the NJSP or our oppressors in the legislature. I've come to believe that NJ's gun owners believe it's just better this way. It's better to just to keep our heads down and try not to be noticed. Maybe if we're nice to them they don't pass more laws against us. don't start trouble. Rape is eminent, relax and enjoy it.

Hopefully this guy does a nice long prison sentence. He deserves it. NJ's gun laws are perfect just the way they are.

[maintenanceguy 510]

Let's pretend that Georgia has a "No Jews Allowed" law and being Jewish is a felony. Some Jewish guy from Florida drives into Atlanta. How many here would say he should go to prison for not knowing the law in Georgia?

Let's check the similarities:

• State violates constitutionally enumerated civil right.
• Guy from another state knowingly or unknowingly exercises that right.
• Guy goes to prison.

I'd like everyone who said this guy deserves what he gets to explain the difference to me.

[jackandjill 683]

Well said MG.

 

On a lighter note, there is South Park episode about Jersey people. So true.

[Fred2 367]

It's kind of fun to go onto a national forum and post in their gun section about NJ laws.

In general, they are dumbfound about what goes on here.

What we call "common sense" they call insanity.

[Howard 538]

I can't believe the people that are attacking a guy for making a mistake.  It's one thing to bring a gun to Times Square in NYC, it's quite another to just barely bring it over the border.  To be guilty of a crime there should be intent to break a law, not just an accidental transgression.  There are many places where you can cross from one state to another and not know it.  There are other cases, like on highways and bridge approaches where you may have missed a small sign and are forced across a state line.  The problem is that in communist New Jermany they prosecute honest citizens that make a technical mistake and plea bargain with criminals that break laws with intent.  This needs to change.

[jackandjill 683]

Another issue with unconstitutional NJ laws is that they result in criminal penalties and record.  While the constitutional protection didnt follow the person into NJ, the penalty and criminal record will certainly follow the  otherwise law abiding person out of NJ. What happens in NJ does not stay in NJ, thanks to "Reasonable Brady Background Checks". 

 

BTW, NJ Laws that criminally punish otherwise constitutionally protected activity squarely fit into definition of "cruel and unusual punishment". They also violate International Humanitarian Laws when it come to punishing someone for otherwise legal activity at large. 

 

 

Imagine US honoring a Taliban conviction for saying "F Al-Qaeda".  But thats exactly what PA (and other states) are forced to do if this guy is convicted in NJ. 

[Zeke 5,504]

I feel bad for the guy in that he is now "jammed up".

But, more media attention on these cases will only shed light on how wrong Nj gun laws are.

I am an American citizen! I live in NJ.

The constitution applies to American citizens.

[jackandjill 683]

Why is this thread buried in General Discussion. Doesnt this fit in "Current Law Discussion" and be available for general public and Google ?

 

MODS, please move this to Law Discussion group if its ok with OP.

[tattooo 220]

^ good point ^

[Newtonian 453]

It's one thing to bring a gun to Times Square in NYC, it's quite another to just barely bring it over the border. 

You're trying too hard, and falling into the same trap as the "he should know the law, screw him" crowd. 

 

Carrying a gun in Times Square to me should be as free of legal consequences as walking to the middle of the Portland-Columbia bridge while carrying and putting your pinkie over the border, or staying put in PA for that matter. 

 

See?

[Howard 538]

You're trying too hard, and falling into the same trap as the "he should know the law, screw him" crowd. 

 

Carrying a gun in Times Square to me should be as free of legal consequences as walking to the middle of the Portland-Columbia bridge while carrying and putting your pinkie over the border, or staying put in PA for that matter. 

 

See?

No, you are totally missing my point.  While I agree with you concept that one should be allowed to carry in Times Square, that has nothing to do with current laws.  The law says he cannot carry in NJ.  I used Times Square as an example because for someone to go from PA to that point they traveled clear across NJ and into another state - that clearly shows they either intentionally violated laws or are too stupid to obey the law.  To just accidentally cross perhaps an unmarked change of state is another issue.  He should be fined, that is it.

[Old Glock guy 1,127]

I feel bad for the guy in that he is now "jammed up".

But, more media attention on these cases will only shed light on how wrong Nj gun laws are.

 

 

I would like to believe that this is true, but there have been several high profile cases similar to this one lately, yet the issue does

not seem to be gaining any traction.

[Newtonian 453]

No, you are totally missing my point.  While I agree with you concept that one should be allowed to carry in Times Square, that has nothing to do with current laws.  The law says he cannot carry in NJ.  I used Times Square as an example because for someone to go from PA to that point they traveled clear across NJ and into another state - that clearly shows they either intentionally violated laws or are too stupid to obey the law.  To just accidentally cross perhaps an unmarked change of state is another issue.  He should be fined, that is it.

In other words "everybody knows" you don't bring a gun into New York City. Fair enough. But it's still wrong to prosecute someone for driving across NJ, or for entering the sacred gun-free zone known as New York City. Maybe more people should violate these laws. Overwhelm them. Would it work?