Going to pull the trigger and do my first build

[EWC88 24]

So I've been thinking about the idea for awhile now and I'm finally going to pull the trigger on doing my first ar. At first I was thinking of just buying one complete but said screw it I would like to "know" the gun so I'm going to build it. The purpose that I want to use this gun for is range and also HD. I wrote up a list of the build which I'll post when I get back home and see what you guys think, there are a couple things I do need help with though which will be posted then too.

 

But my first question for you guys, might be dumb, when looking at a complete upper, and it says 16" is that referring to total length or just barrel? I ask because I was thinking to do a 14.5" barrel and then the muzzle adding the extra proper length, I didn't know if the 16" complete uppers was total length of barrel and muzzle or not.

[Krdshrk 3,877]

16" total length.  I have a 14.5" Midlength barrel with a pinned brake that makes 16" total.

[louu 399]

If your gonna ASSEMBLE a rifle why would you be looking at complete uppers? The upper is easier to assemble than the lower. If you need to borrow a vice block and torque wrench adapter pm me. 

[Krdshrk 3,877]

If your gonna ASSEMBLE a rifle why would you be looking at complete uppers? The upper is easier to assemble than the lower. If you need to borrow a vice block and torque wrench adapter pm me. 

 

Requires more tools.  Just need a screwdriver, a couple punches and a hammer/mallet for a lower, really.  

[Scorpio64 5,147]

If you enjoyed playing with erector sets and building models of military ships and planes, you will almost definitely find building your own AR an enjoyable, satisfying experience.

 

If it says 16", that's the barrel length without the muzzle device.  if it says 14.5, it's the actual bbl length without the muzzle device factored in but with the understanding there will be a device on it to bring the oal of the barrel to 16" or greater.

[Displaced Texan 11,731]

Just as a frame of reference, a 16" barrel with an A2 length muzzle is 17.5" OAL.

I prefer the 14.5" setup with a muzzle device to bring it to 16". That extra 1.5" makes a big difference in how the weapon handles. Getting in and out of a vehicle especially.

 

No 'that's what she said' jokes...lol

[EWC88 24]

I was debating whether to buy complete upper or just fully build upper and wasn't positive. I'll have to look at everything broken down and come up with list of I decide to build upper myself.

 

What would be good places or brands to look for barrels?

[Displaced Texan 11,731]

I think these days its hard to beat complete uppers, since AR-15's are so cheap. Its seems to be, in most cases, cheaper to buy a complete upper than source the parts and build yourself, unless you are looking for a very specific combination.

 

I have good experience with the premium uppers from Palmetto State Armory. Haven't used their Freedom, or PTAC parts before, but the premium is pretty good stuff, at a good price. The premium BCG is good to go too.

[EWC88 24]

I need to look more for deals and all but this is what my original thought was so far for the AR with a completed upper:

 

MOE Stock ( whats difference between this one and CTR)

Midwest MCTAR-21G2 Mid Length FF handrail

BCM 14.5" M4 Carbine Upper Receiver Group

Anderson Stripped Lower

BCM Gunfighter CH

MBUS Rear Sights

 

 

Not positive on LPK, I know Geissle is amazing from what I read, but doing a lot of research I see people saying when it comes to a person first AR they should not go with the Geissle and should start off on a standard LPK to get the feel and everything. What are your thoughts?

 

Also for the BCG I read that Chrome line is the way to go, but also heard great things on the NiBX, thoughts?

 

I am trying figure a muzzle brake I like, and I want to add a light, red dont and possibly magnifier but not sure.

 

Comments I appreciate

[Displaced Texan 11,731]

BCM and PSA (premium) both use FN made CHF barrels, so IMHO, its kind of a wash as to which one you use. Dictated by price and availability to me.

BIG fan of the BCM Gunfighter charging handle. I have one on all my AR's. Medium for me, please.

Lately, I have been using this muzzle device for my 14.5" AR's:  https://store.ar15.com/product.html?cat=45&pr=650

It's inexpensive enough and works.

I use DD LPK's on build guns, I find they have a better out of the box mil spec trigger than my Colts. I replace them with ALG ACT triggers anyway. I like a single stage, mil spec type trigger, instead of a 2 stage trigger some guys like. Just what I'm used to.

I would try the mil spec first and see what you think. You can always, and easily, upgrade.

 

The lower doesn't really matter that much, as long as it's in spec, and you like the roll mark, use it.

 

 

Furniture is personal preference. I like the BCM Mod 0 grips, your mileage may vary.

[tattooo 220]

Its easier to do then you think

[EWC88 24]

I actually like that muzzle a lot, I wanted something that wasn't flashy, just some simple and sleek which to me that is, thanks for posting that!

 

I am sorry I am still a noob to this but what is FN and CHF?

 

Because I never done this, since you said the lower doesn't matter as long as its in spec, what exactly do I look for to make sure its all correct?

[Displaced Texan 11,731]

FN is a company,  Fabrique Nationale. FN builds M16A4's for Uncle Sam, and a lot of other firearms.

They produce for the commercial market, a few AR's, as well as making barrels, and other components.

 

CHF means cold hammer forged. A barrel making process. Highly debated topic if CHF is superior to button rifled barrels. Beyond the scope of this thread.

 

Buy a lower from a reputable mfg, and you should be ok. Anderson makes decent lowers. My favorite (other than my Colt lowers) are the forged lowers from Mega Machine and tool: http://www.megaarms.com/ar-15/lower-receivers/forged-lower/

Are they any better than anyone elses? Not sure, but I have never run across one that was out of spec. Besides, I like the roll mark.

[Krdshrk 3,877]

I need to look more for deals and all but this is what my original thought was so far for the AR with a completed upper:

 

MOE Stock ( whats difference between this one and CTR)

Midwest MCTAR-21G2 Mid Length FF handrail

BCM 14.5" M4 Carbine Upper Receiver Group

Anderson Stripped Lower

BCM Gunfighter CH

MBUS Rear Sights

 

 

Not positive on LPK, I know Geissle is amazing from what I read, but doing a lot of research I see people saying when it comes to a person first AR they should not go with the Geissle and should start off on a standard LPK to get the feel and everything. What are your thoughts?

 

Also for the BCG I read that Chrome line is the way to go, but also heard great things on the NiBX, thoughts?

 

I am trying figure a muzzle brake I like, and I want to add a light, red dont and possibly magnifier but not sure.

 

Comments I appreciate

 

Difference between the MOE and the CTR is the friction lock.  MOE has the standard release lever in the center of the stock.  CTR has the friction lock.  The big difference?  MOE will have a bit of stock wobble against the buffer tube, where the CTR will not.

 

Have you considered a midlength gas system instead of a carbine?  They're generally softer shooting and produce slightly less recoil over a carbine length system.

 

As for the LPK, I've generally run PSA LPKs, which are pretty decent.  If you want to lighten it up a bit, throw in some JP Trigger/Hammer springs.  Even better trigger, ALG ACT.  I have the ACT in my 14.5" Spikes Midlength combined with the JP Springs - light crisp trigger pull and doesn't break the bank.  If you want to go all out, get a Geissele trigger.  Keep in mind you're spending 2.5x as much as an ALG 

[njpilot 671]

Have you considered a midlength gas system instead of a carbine?  They're generally softer shooting and produce slightly less recoil over a carbine length system.

 

 

I was gonna suggest the same thing. I have a BCM 14.5" CHF mid-length. Nice upper.

[High Exposure 5,661]

Requires more tools. Just need a screwdriver, a couple punches and a hammer/mallet for a lower, really.

I built a lower for a guy at work last week. I forgot my tools, ending up using nothing but a paper clip and a multitasker.

[Displaced Texan 11,731]

I built a lower for a guy at work last week. I forgot my tools, ending up using nothing but a paper clip and a multitasker.

Change your screen name to McGuyver. Paper clip!! Lmao

[High Exposure 5,661]

Change your screen name to McGuyver. Paper clip!! Lmao

Paper clip worked perfectly for installing the pivot pin detent.

[High Exposure 5,661]

Oh, and I agree on the barrel/gas system - midlength is the way to go. I prefer the 14.5" with perm attached muzzle device. Personally a complete upper is the way to go.

 

I am partial to BCM but Primary Arms currently has a 16" midlength Troy upper for $599 that is a steal when you add up what the individual parts would cost:

http://www.primaryarms.com/search.aspx?ss=Troy+upper

 

As for LPK, look at Midwest PX (a forum sponsor and great guy) ALG ACT LPK. Their server is down but you can reach him by email:

[email protected]

or by phone:

815.246.2715

[Krdshrk 3,877]

Oh, and I agree on the barrel/gas system - midlength is the way to go. I prefer the 14.5" with perm attached muzzle device.

 

It's gotta be permanently attached by NJ Law anyway so unless you're going for a long range precision rifle, might as well get it as short as possible!

[High Exposure 5,661]

Some people say a 16" midlength barrel shoots better than the 14.5" barrel. I disagree and feel the 14.5" shoots softer.

[EWC88 24]

I'll be honest, because I know nothing about AR's I just saw that upper right away and picked it, I did notice under it was the exact same but mid length not carbine, and I wasn't positive the difference. If mid length is the recommended upper I will go that route for sure.

 

I guess for trigger it's really not a negative whatever option I pick, so I'll browse that idea.

 

Anyone have a recommendation far as BCG? Should I go chrome or NiBX? Or a different route?

 

Also am I missing anything else? Does the butt stock come with the buffer tube for inside?

[Eric. 9]

Just to muddy the waters more, there are a lot of options.  It would have helped if you gave a rough budget figure.

 

Since you stated "range toy and HD gun", there isnt a need to over spend on premium barrels and such, unless you are into precision rifle shooting.  That said, a complete upper, as others have mentioned, might give you the most bang for your buck.

 

While AR's are very simple to assemble, you do need some special tools.  You need an armorer's wrench, which can handle certain functions like:

 

-tighten the standard barrel nut

-tighten a castle nut (if you are going with an adjustable stock, that will be pinned)

 

Also, you will need an AR assembly block.  While it isn't a necessity, it does make life a lot easier, especially when torquing down a barrel nut.  The assembly block provides support for the fragile upper section where the ejection port is.  Without it, it is easy to bend the lower port area that can cause your BCG to bind or worse yet, split the upper receiver there.

 

Aside from that, everything else can be done with simple hand tools (or, paperclips like Rick mentioned).

 

Edit-

For a BCG, NP3 is my preferred coating.  Nitride and Nickle Boron are popular too.  Then again, depending on your budget, it might be an unnecessary cost for a range toy/HD gun. 

 

butt stocks usually do NOT come with a buffer tube.  There are 3 types of tubes-A2, mil spec and commercial.  It all depends on what stock you are running.  If you are not running an A2 (M16 looking" stock, then you need a mil spec or commercial tube.  I would go with the mil spec tube.  Make sure you buy a matching mil spec butt stock too, so it will fit properly.

[Scorpio64 5,147]

I put NiB BCGs in both my rifles.  They are super easy to clean.  However, I cant really say if they function any better than an ordinary chrome lined phosphated or melonite finished BCG.

[Displaced Texan 11,731]

For over 30 years, and countless thousands of rounds, I have used mil spec (Colt)bog standard phosphate coated BCG's with ZERO problems. Personally, I think the fancy coatings are just marketing hype.

[High Exposure 5,661]

I am cautious putting a NiB bolt carrier in a high use rifle. The NiB BCGs allegedly run much cooler than MilSpec versions - which is great in and of itself.

 

Except, the rifle is still generating the same amount of heat and that heat has to go somewhere. If the BCG runs cooler, that means it is not sinking heat from the barrel extension. That means the chamber will retain more heat, which I don't think is the greatest idea for the overall health of the rifle, or the rounds being loaded in the chamber.

 

For me, MilSpec BCGs are where it's at for any gun that is not just a range toy.

[Eric. 9]

For over 30 years, and countless thousands of rounds, I have used mil spec (Colt)bog standard phosphate coated BCG's with ZERO problems. Personally, I think the fancy coatings are just marketing hype.

To a certain degree, you are right. 

 

With NP3, for instance, it does have self lubricating properties i.e. the PTFE mixed into the coating.  I've run one dry, just to see what the failure point is.  It nvr stopped cycling, although I didnt test it under full auto conditions.

 

That said, if you run your BCG "wet", like you are supposed to (I use Mobil 1 motor oil), you may not need the extra layer of protection/function that the coated BCG's offer.

 

I'm not a fan of Nickel Boron coatings.  It's a heavier coating, almost like plating and can separate from the BCG (kinda like chrome plating).

[EWC88 24]

Yes this AR is not going to be precision rifle, after this AR when I know I'll want more I will then have dedicated rifle for specific shooting. This being my first AR I want it to be a all around gun, so going to range with it, and For my HD.

 

Now far as price this is where that's hard for me. Obviously I would like to make it as cheap as possible but having it be a great gun that's reliable so I can spend more on ammo, but I'm a firm believer of you get what you pay for. I figured for gun to be looking at $1k, optics and what not would be additional. Now if I can keep it less than that, that is GREAT in my eyes.

 

Like I have said I know nothing with ARs and doing research I see get chrome line barrels and chrome BCG, or the NiBX. That's only reason why I mentioned those. From responses it seems that I could go for a different coating and basically save money and still have a great BCG.

[Displaced Texan 11,731]

I'm aware of the lubricity of PTFE. Also be aware that some of the processes to plate the BCG's with these materials can make them brittle, and prone to premature failure.

 

I prefer to run a mil spec, phosphate BCG, wet. Wetter is better..with good lube. I also use Mobil 1 synthetic.

[Eric. 9]

Yes this AR is not going to be precision rifle, after this AR when I know I'll want more I will then have dedicated rifle for specific shooting. This being my first AR I want it to be a all around gun, so going to range with it, and For my HD.

 

Now far as price this is where that's hard for me. Obviously I would like to make it as cheap as possible but having it be a great gun that's reliable so I can spend more on ammo, but I'm a firm believer of you get what you pay for. I figured for gun to be looking at $1k, optics and what not would be additional. Now if I can keep it less than that, that is GREAT in my eyes.

 

That said, you can easily build it for around $600 to 800ish (minus optic).

 

Like I have said I know nothing with ARs and doing research I see get chrome line barrels and chrome BCG, or the NiBX. That's only reason why I mentioned those. From responses it seems that I could go for a different coating and basically save money and still have a great BCG.

 

A basic chrome lined barrel is the most inexpensive and will be good for 10,000 rounds.  For a range toy and HD gun, it will be fine.

High Exposure suggested an upper form Primary Arms (Troy).  Taht comes with flip up sights and a free float rail.  To me, that is a lot of value for the cash.  It should cover all of your requirements and then some.

 

Let me know when you want to build a precision SPR.  I'll help you spend the kid's college fund.