Good Firearm's Safe with WEIRD requirement.

[Lambo2936 297]

Hey all. Currently in the process of obtaining my FID & Handgun license here in The Republic of NJ. I've been looking at getting a Nice safe as i have a 5 month old in the house and the last thing i want is her (or anybody, for that matter) getting her hands on a firearm. The problem is, i currently live in a Mobile Home (No, not a tow along, the Trailer Park Type). I Plan on moving fairly soon as there is simply no room for the wife and baby and i in a 500 sqft home which was fine when we moved in right before she got pregnant. Anyhow, Because i am in a Mobile Home, weight is a pretty big problem. Even though the home is New (Well, now over a year old) and is built significantly stronger than older homes were built, i am still worried about putting a 500+lb empty safe in the home. I Want to buy as big of a safe as i can because i intend on moving and am fully intent on growing my collection, but on the other hand i don't want it falling through the floor. For those of you familiar with Aquariums, i had a 75 gallon tank (probably about 750lbs when loaded with gravel and water plus everything under it, if not more) in there for 6 months and decided to take it out because i was worried about the weight, and i would think a nice safe like i'd want is about 500lbs plus the weight of the firearms and ammo would probably put it at MORE than that per SQFT because its so dense (as opposed to about a 2x4' area).
I'm not sure what to do, to be honest. I Would like the type of safes that are Half rifle storage and half shelving for ammo, etc. I've been looking mainly at what home depot has because i have quite a bit of store credit there from the Construction work i do and having just cleaned out the shed and returned a bunch of stuff that i have left from projects that i threw in there. So the safe would basically be half off there. If i do pay 'cash' for one, which i am fine with doing as i can spend the store credit on other stuff, i would like to order a liberty safe, maybe the revolution 24, just because of how sturdy the pins look on those.
Any suggestions? I'm at a total loss as to what to do. I'd like to be under 1,000$ or so. Home depot stock's some nice cannon safes, i know the model "HD5526-H1-FEC" they have online is just at 1,000+tax and weighs about 300lbs. 
Anyone have any suggestions? What would you do? Sorry for the ridiculously long post, but i literally have been staring at safes for days whenever i have free time. I have a feeling the wife will lock me in it when i do finally order one.
Thanks

[W2MC 1,699]

Have you looked at the lock-up cabinets?  Walmart has a bunch of them, starting at about $100.  http://www.walmart.com/search/?query=gun%20cabinet

 

I've posted this here and on other sites several times.....my thoughts on sheet metal cabinets versus gun safes:

Its all about threat levels, and what is your goal in protection. 

If your goal is to keep the kids (and the teenage "opportunistic" thieves) out of the guns, one of those sheet metal cabinets is more than sufficient - they aren't going to even try to open the door. 

If you are trying to protect from the typical 'smash and grab' thief, a cabinet is also more than sufficient - it will slow them down considerably, and they want to get "in and out" as fast as possible. 

If you are trying to protect against an organized bunch that is bent on getting into your stuff; well, it depends. Is the typical thief going to have enough time to cut thru the lock/door without interruption, or enough time, ability and cover to rip it off the wall and carry it to a waiting pickup truck?  If so, then you need a bigger/heavier safe.  If not, then one of the metal cabinets will suffice.

 

Having said all that.....I've used the Homak version of your Stack-On 8-rifle with the Pistol Cabinet bolted on top for years....if you take the foam barrel rest out and replace it with a piece of felt or something else that's soft, and put some of your rifles/shotguns muzzle down, you can get a LOT more than 8 in there.

[W2MC 1,699]

One other thought - the gun cabinets sell fast when listed here.  You can start with one, then sell it when you move out of the mobile home.

[dajonga 396]

Lambo,

 

Welcome to the group and welcome to the exciting world of gun ownership in the PRNJ!

 

I agree with the above. I have a Homak metal cabinet I bought used for $60 on CL. It can't weigh more than 50 lbs. empty and its footprint is only 24" x 18" or so. I also bought a double doored storage cabinet to use for my rimfire rifles and all ammo & equipment. I added some hardware to it to lock with a padlock. Total for that one is $35.

 

They provide all the protection I need to keep the kids out.

 

I really see no need for a monster fire proof safe for my guns. I own nothing of high value or sentimental value. If a fire destroys the guns, I will go buy more with the insurance money.

 

If a badguy gets in to my house, the alarm is going to be triggered. I seriously doubt that badguy then has the time to get into those cabinets before the police show up. I live in a modest house in a modest neighborhood. I doubt a "serious" thief is going to look twice at my house. I would expect to be robbed by neighborhood teenagers and druggies. I keep a low profile in regards to owning guns. No stickers or signs on my house or car, and I try to make sure no neighbors see me when I am loading up for a range trip. 

 

Also, if physical space is an issue, you could use one of these lightweight cabinets on its back under a bed or a table. Cover it with a table cloth & BINGO! Instant coffee table. The doors are light enough to lift up with no effort.

 

If you decide to upgrade to a big safe, turn the cabinet into an ammo & equipment locker. Or flip it here.

 

Good luck and have fun!

[T Bill 649]

No tax on gun safes purchased in NJ.

[mark42361 8]

I live in a mobile home that was built in 1995. I have a 500lb gun safe with a few hundred pounds of stuff in it. I also have a gun cabinet filled with ammo weighing about the same. I have had no issues and don't worry about it at all. I am sure you are fine.

[Lalo 13]

Get an inexpensive ~$200 cabinet for now until you move to a home. Once you move, sell the cabinet here and get a nice, big, expensive safe that will be with you for a while.

[PD2K 115]

I agree with the above forumites. Buy something for now to keep the kiddies out. When you move, upgrade to a bigger and better safe.

[Krdshrk 3,877]

I just have a small cabinet as well.  Just lock up the guns - put the ammo in some ammo cans... 

[Heavyopp 167]

You could also use one of those jobsite tool boxes -- they sell easily too if you decide you want to upgrade

[Lambo2936 297]

Thanks for replying folks. I'm glad i got such a huge response, i was worried this was another dead forum with 3 active posters.
I Live in the Woodbridge area; Not a bad area, however its not unheard of for criminals to come into our area from Linden, Elizabeth, etc. right up Rt. 1&9 to the North.
I don't care for fireproofing either. Chances are if my house burns down, the 30 minute fireproofing wont do much; Mobile homes are basically infamous for burning down pretty quick, and honestly if a few thousand dollars in firearms go with the house, i don't think i'd care as it isn't a necessity. My important papers are already in a small fireproof safe. It just adds unnecessary weight, however, other than a CABINET, i can't seem to find a large safe that isn't fireproof. I Have some Gladiator Cabinet's at work (look those up on home depot) that are really nice and have a lock built in and all, but they aren't too pretty and i'm not sure as to how break in proof those are. I Think my best bet would be to go with a mid sized safe with low/no fireproof rating just to be safe for now. Craigslist seems to have all of three or four safes on there priced at a premium, so i'm sure if i need to upgrade in a few years i can sell my used safe for a few hundred bucks less and pick up a nice one. If all goes well, by then i'll be able to pick up one of the huge high end ones that are rated to 90+ minutes fireproof. For now i'm thinking something along the lines of a Revolution 24 or maybe the 24 gun Cannon Shield thats available on Home Depot for 999$. I Know the cannon is nice and only a bit over 300lbs.
 

[Lambo2936 297]

Oh, Also, Should i go with a Combination lock or an Electronic lock? I'm a big fan of digital and all of that, however i have read all over that the Electronic locks found on Safe's are all crap and tend to fail. I Don't want to have to keep replacing 100$ keypads on my safe. On the other hand, if there is every a problem and i have to get into my safe quick, i'd imagine i'd be screwed trying to get into a combo safe.
 

[SuRrEaLNJ 294]

i folowed somebody else's lead and build my cabinet out of a craftsman storage locker i cut the shelves up in to fit long guns. was able to score the cabinet for 200 ish, holds alot more than a comparable gun safe and isnt to heavy

[Krdshrk 3,877]

Look at Harbor Freight for their gun safe - Electronic locks are fine if you have key backup.

 

The HF safe isn't too big or heavy... not fireproof... it's a little sturdier than a cabinet.

[Lambo2936 297]

Will look into it when i get home. Going to look into the cabinet as well, thats not a bad idea and is much cheaper.

Somebody above mentioned no sales tax on safes in NJ but when putting one in my cart, home depot automatically adds the sales taxes. Is that law in writing? If so ill contact HD customer service and see what they say.

Thanks!

[Heavyopp 167]

While your researching just search you tube for gun safe break in

 

In the price range and weight your looking at your getting security from your kids and thats about it

 

A thief with a 4 foot pry bar will be into the safe in under a minute

 

 

No real security till your a few thousand pounds

[dajonga 396]

I believe a cabinet is not considered a safe

[T Bill 649]

Sales tax exemption discussion

 

http://njgunforums.com/forum/index.php/topic/30709-nj-gun-vault-sales-tax-exemption/

[Lambo2936 297]

Thanks for the link, im going to check it out now. Maybe itll allow me to save a few bucks.
I Realize that a gun safe may be easier than many expect to get into, but the point is for it to be a deterrent. If somebody wants to get in and has enough time, the biggest and strongest safe in the world won't really help. But if somebody breaks in, chances are my neighbors will notice and call the police long before they have a chance to break into the safe. I'm also not worried about somebody stealing my firearms as much as i am worried about my child/Future children from hurting themselves or others, however, having basic security features is always nice. Hell, if somebody really wanted to they could back a semi up to my house, bolt the tongue back on that is currently under the house hidden, and just drive right off! It's on blocks but the tires and all are still on it, hahahahaha.
I Have a warehouse in Newark, NJ. It's locked. If somebody wants to get in, they will just jack the door up. That doesn't mean im going to leave the gate wide open. If it stops 99% of the thieves that walk by every day, its doing a damn good job for the little bit it costs. That's how i see it. For 600$, if it stops ONE thief from getting away with my firearms and using it to commit crimes, then i'm willing to spend that 600$ instead of 200$ for a cabinet.
Anyhow, i think im going to get the 24 Gun Buck Commander safe from Home Depot. Has nice door storage and all, and is more than big enough for at least the next couple of years, at which point i can always use this as an ammo safe or sell it and buy a much larger one/whatever size is needed. And at 600$, i will only have to take a few bucks out of pocket after i use my store credit. Sounds like a plan to me!

[Lambo2936 297]

Contacted home depot. Turns out certain safes are not considered gun safes which is why it was charging tax on 1 i was looking at. Weird. Just ordered a buck commander safe for 600$ and no sales tax. Not top of the line but looks pirty and will keep the average thief out. Also on the lighter end of the safes i was looking at. Can store up to 12 firearms with the 1 side set up with shelves plus handgun dtorage on the door. Not bad and will be enough for a while. Key override in case electronics fail.

Thanks for the help! Now i have to decide what to buy and what other random odds and ends i need to get. Hopefully the license doesnt take too long. I should have waited on the safe but itll take 2 to 3 weeks to arrive and i have 30 days to get it from the store so ill probably just delay it. Theyve been running out of most stack on safes and raising prices so i didnt want to wait, haha.

[W2MC 1,699]

Was in Dick's Sporting Goods earlier today - This 8-gun safe is on-sale for $199.97.  

 

http://www.dickssportinggoods.com/product/index.jsp?productId=66575356&cp=4406646.4413993.4414427.4414433&categoryId=11484400&fg=Number%20of%20Guns

[Lambo2936 297]

Was in Dick's Sporting Goods earlier today - This 8-gun safe is on-sale for $199.97.  

 

http://www.dickssportinggoods.com/product/index.jsp?productId=66575356&cp=4406646.4413993.4414427.4414433&categoryId=11484400&fg=Number%20of%20Guns

Oh man, if i saw that earlier i'd probably get one of those and hold of on a larger safe until i moved. Unfortunately i already ordered a huge one. :/

Thank for the link, though. Worst case this 24 gun one i bought will become all storage at a later date when i get to the point of owning an armory.

[W2MC 1,699]

They're like potato chips....you cant have just one.

[Zeke 5,504]

Oh man, if i saw that earlier i'd probably get one of those and hold of on a larger safe until i moved. Unfortunately i already ordered a huge one. :/

Thank for the link, though. Worst case this 24 gun one i bought will become all storage at a later date when i get to the point of owning an armory.

You'll find the 24 only fits 12

[Lambo2936 297]

Yes, i figured as much. I Read everywhere that the rating is generally twice what it actually holds. Its crazy that nobody has sued any of these large safe companies for false advertisement. Heck, even in the picture it doesn't look like theres any more than 6 rifles on the one side that doesn't have shelves and it looks packed, haha.
I Only intend on purchasing three rifles/long guns and a handgun or two in the near future, and the handguns go on the door. I May not even need the storage on the one side of the safe because id imagine any ammo i have would fit on top. The safe should last me a while until i move and have the money to grow my collection.

[mipafox 438]

Grrrr.....

[W2MC 1,699]

Well........as with everything, "it depends".

 

 

My "8-gun" cabinet was purchased at K-Mart about 20 years ago, and its the only one I've had.  Looks a lot like this one (well, at least it did when it was new):

 

http://cdn2.armslist.com/sites/armslist/uploads/posts/2011/05/30/142592_02_homak_8_gun_cabinet_640.jpg

 

It was called an "8-gun" because the foam backer/separator (a stick-on with double-faced tape) had 8 barrel notches on it.  I added the "pistol cabinet" as a bolt-on to the top about a year or two later.  If memory serves, there are currently 20 "long" guns in there (including two with scopes attached).  Some are stored butt-down, some are stored muzzle-down.  That alone saves considerable space inside the cabinet. 

 

The best thing you can do is take that foam separator out and throw it away.  It will deteriorate in 5-10 years into some sort of sticky goo that thankfully, Hoppe's #9 will take off the barrels.  It separates each gun from the other, and it makes them look good as a display, but it also restricts what you can put into there.  I replaced the foam on the back and on the bottom with some old "fake fur" that my wife had lying around from some sewing project.  Its pretty good padding, and being a synthetic, It won't hold moisture against the metal.

 

As with anything, YMMV.  You have to be gentle moving stuff around in there, and you may have to take a couple out to get at the one in the back, but the cheap little $100 cabinet has served me well.

[Krdshrk 3,877]

It was called an "8-gun" because the foam backer/separator (a stick-on with double-faced tape) had 8 barrel notches on it.  I added the "pistol cabinet" as a bolt-on to the top about a year or two later.  If memory serves, there are currently 20 "long" guns in there (including two with scopes attached).  Some are stored butt-down, some are stored muzzle-down.  That alone saves considerable space inside the cabinet. 

 

I've got about 10 long guns in my Stack-on 8-Gun Ready to Assemble cabinet.  Some are smaller (Ruger 10/22) and fit in better than others.

[Lambo2936 297]

I'm not all that worried about it. Even 10 guns is more than enough space for at least a year or two. The door has one of those storage systems on it for i believe 4 hand guns and some other random junk so i can make it entirely rifles with handguns on the door if i have to and get a few ammo cans that lock or somethin'. 
As for the foam, i'm not sure what this one will have but i can always make my own my routing out some 3/4" plywood and covering it in something when need be. I'm pretty good at making stuff like that up, so until its deemed necessary i have lots of time to think about what i want to do or if to upgrade or whatever.

Thanks for the great advice! Convinced my mom to apply for her FID so we can shoot together, haha. Last time she fired a weapon was in the IDF nearly 30 years ago.

[The brew guy 22]

I'm another one who has that "ready-to-assemble" cabinet. I covered the back with construction adhesive before attaching it to my foundation with half a dozen 1/2" lag bolts and anchors. It's not coming out without a cubic yard of concrete still attached to it. Pry it open or cut it open, but you won't be taking the whole thing.

I also lined the interior with ultra-cheap outdoor carpeting from home depot. It's the same stuff that most safes are lined with, holds Velcro, etc. and some thin weatherstripping around the door. The carpet looks much nicer and between it and the weatherstripping, the tinny steel cabinet sound is gone. I also replaced the shelf and racks with some scrap mahogany I had left from another project (with felt on the racks) and installed a battery powered light.

I currently have 5 long guns in it and I'll easily get a few more in it.