Out of state purchases of resticted or banned items

[JackDaWack 2,895]

Just got an e-mail asking me for my FPID on some pistol ammo. Normally I sent it with a question in regards to why they feel i need it.

 

response: "It is required for shipment of ammunition to your state."

 

Now my normal response is why are you following or enforcing a law that doesn't apply to anything beyond the boundaries on NJ.

 

But then it got me thinking, would they get in trouble if they shipped say 30rd mags to NJ residents? I know no ones does, but it goes with this mentality of enforcing the laws beyond the jurisdiction.

[PK90 3,570]

I suspect that the seller's civil liability would increase.

 

Sent from an undisclosed location via Tapatalk.

 

 

[GRIZ 3,369]

I agree with PK90. Ammo is one thing. Legal to have or purchase with restrictions. 30 rd magazines are another.

[SmittyMHS 603]

Its funny (well not really) I think its all according to their lawyers. Some ask for your FPID and some don't. I just had a back and forth with Sportsmans Guide over them restricting everything for black guns. They said its a corporate policy (lawyers) yet they never ask for ID on ammo purchases. Other places just have a disclaimer that says its up to the buyer to know the laws of their state and will ship (almost) anything.

[RecessedFilter 222]

I've always wondered who would be at fault if a company sent a nj buyer an illegal firearm part. As long as the company has a disclaimer staying know your states' laws, I feel if you ordered a 30rd mag and got caught with it, you are liable, not the company.

 

Like with firearms, I believe once a nj ffl takes possession of say an illegal AR, it is then their responsibility to modify it accordingly and make it legal before transferring it to the customer. If they sold it Unmodified, it would be there fault and NOT the original seller.

[Zeke 5,504]

This is the major problem with firearms. States rights vs the fed.

You have the fed,atf making rules. Then states make there own rules.

It doesn't make any sense.

[JackDaWack 2,895]

I agree with PK90. Ammo is one thing. Legal to have or purchase with restrictions. 30 rd magazines are another.

But wouldn't buying pistol ammo with out a FPID be just as "illegal". Just playing devils advocate here.

 

I suspect that the seller's civil liability would increase.

 

Sent from an undisclosed location via Tapatalk.

That would be my responsibility, no? Is it reasonable to ask a national retailer to know every single state law in the country?

[T Bill 649]

First any state is allowed to enact laws that are more restrictive than the Federal Government. That has been true on various fronts for a long time.  They cannot enact laws that are in violation to Federal law.  But, we see how that is working out with "weed" laws.  Obama has said  no time to enforce Federal law, so states are free to do what they want.  This is why the Federal courts are dodging the gun law issues.

 

Second, NJ has in the past dragged out of state companies into court for violation of NJ laws. Not that they would win, it's just harassment.  Make the retailer spend time and money in court defending their position.  So they cave and don't ship.  Funny how deep the government pockets are when they want something

[PK90 3,570]

I wish I was never a gun dealer in NJ. I would sell you guys all the "high capacity" magazines and any ammo you want without restrictions. I could never play dumb on this issue. F*#k NJ politicians.

[mipafox 438]

Jersey has repeatedly bullied and sued companies in other states for selling to Jersey subjects. They prime example is when they managed to force people selling tobacco products to turn over their customer lists and purchase records for people in Jersey that had been buying cigarettes online for years, retroactively.

 

Who wants to run their business from a courtroom?

 

Why do you think Heritage (purportedly) has signs saying "nobody from Jersey can buy this?" I've never seen those signs but I haven't been there in a while.

[GRIZ 3,369]

But wouldn't buying pistol ammo with out a FPID be just as "illegal". Just playing devils advocate here.

 

 

That would be my responsibility, no? Is it reasonable to ask a national retailer to know every single state law in the country?

My take is its not illegal to purchase pistol ammo out of state without a FID even by internet. Many NJ residents routinely buy ammo out of state. If they can be determined these dealers could face civil liability as internet sellers. The point of purchase is where the dealer charges your credit card AFAIC.

 

The fact is once you possess the ammo bought via the Internet it is legal to possess. If you get a more than 15 rd magazine it's illegal to possess in NJ.

 

If a dealer sells pistol ammo and 30 rd magazines to someone who uses them in a mass shooting, someone will probably sue him for whatever they can get. Being it was an interstate sale that would probably be enough to file the lawsuit in a Federal court. Never heard of this happening but some ammo dealers ask for a copy of the FID to CYA. I can't blame them.

 

Ignorance of any law is never an excuse.

[fslater 62]

Look at it from a different prospective: Some states are now legalizing sale and recreational use of pot. What if a person or pot shop (where it is legal) shipped to a state where its not? Have they broken no laws?

[JackDaWack 2,895]

Look at it from a different prospective: Some states are now legalizing sale and recreational use of pot. What if a person or pot shop (where it is legal) shipped to a state where its not? Have they broken no laws?

Probably a few federal laws.

[JackDaWack 2,895]

 

Ignorance of any law is never an excuse.

If your within a jurisdiction the law applies I agree, but lets say for example I ordered alcohol off the internet and I lived in a dry county. Were talking about a gun dealer knowing every mundane and confusing gun laws.... it's gotten so bad some of these places outright refuse to deal with orders from certain states.

[GRIZ 3,369]

If your within a jurisdiction the law applies I agree, but lets say for example I ordered alcohol off the internet and I lived in a dry county. Were talking about a gun dealer knowing every mundane and confusing gun laws.... it's gotten so bad some of these places outright refuse to deal with orders from certain states.

If you got drunk from that alcohol and drove a car and killed someone whoever sent you the alcohol could still face liability.

 

You really can't pick and choose which laws you want to be ignorant of. Where do you draw the line if you do? I agree laws can be confusing. Many businesses prefer to not sell certain items to people in states with laws that might put them in jeopardy and that's their option.

[PK90 3,570]

Firearm dealers are given a book of firearm laws of all the states when they receive their license. It is available on the internet for everyone. It also includes the local laws in each state.

 

Sent from an undisclosed location via Tapatalk.

 

 

[PK90 3,570]

DT

[SmittyMHS 603]

Firearm dealers are given a book of firearm laws of all the states when they receive their license. It is available on the internet for everyone. It also includes the local laws in each state.

 

Sent from an undisclosed location via Tapatalk.

Which is more then we're given when we get our ID. And we just have to worry about our state.

 

Just sayin....

[PK90 3,570]

Which is more then we're given when we get our ID. And we just have to worry about our state.

 

Just sayin....

 

STATE LAWS AND PUBLISHED ORDINANCES - FIREARMS (31ST EDITION – 2010 - 2011)

[SmittyMHS 603]

STATE LAWS AND PUBLISHED ORDINANCES - FIREARMS (31ST EDITION – 2010 - 2011)

You just exceeded what we get from PRNJ when getting our ID by 516 pages.   

 I sure hope they don't test you on it!

[JackDaWack 2,895]

Firearm dealers are given a book of firearm laws of all the states when they receive their license. It is available on the internet for everyone. It also includes the local laws in each state.

 

Sent from an undisclosed location via Tapatalk.

Now that is something i didn't know.. interesting.

[PK90 3,570]

As a comparison of the number of pages of laws in the manual:

NJ has 16

PA has 9

SC has 7

AZ has 5.5

TX has 2.5

[WP22 1,558]

As a comparison of the number of pages of laws in the manual:

NJ has 16

PA has 9

SC has 7

AZ has 5.5

TX has 2.5

 

 

How can that be?

[SmittyMHS 603]

How can that be?

I hope that was sarcastic...lol

 

If not...

Cause this is New Jersey. And most all of the law makers here take the small bus to and from Trenton.